The Beatles: Rock Band - No Drum Fills?

[Jordanfre]

I'm not sure if anyone else noticed this, but in the new e3 trailer if you look carefully at the drum charts there are some sections where a green note that looks exactly like the one you would see at the end of a fill comes along. I think star power activates after hitting it (not entirely sure, youtube blocked at school) and if it does this might mean there are no drum fills in TB:RB.

Does anyone know why they decided to do this? My best guess is that they didn't want to alter the songs too much and drum fills would ruin their classic songs. I know all the songs in RB2 have fills in them but this could have been a decision made by the two Beatles (Paul and Ringo) but I'll be dissapointed if there arn't any drum fills in this game.

[acidicthought8]

My best guess is that they didn't want to alter the songs too much and drum fills would ruin their classic songs.

This. It's not HMX's fault, it's a Beatles thing.

[ExcessNeo]

This. It's not HMX's fault, it's a Beatles thing.

I think it's brilliant personally, I'd like to be able to play the proper fills when they actually come.

Atleast Harmonix didn't go the Guitar Hero route and make you hit 2 pads to activate.

A tilt sensor would be funny though ;)

[seinman]

I noticed in one of the videos that, right before that note, the whole green lane lights up like it does for regular drum fills. The other lanes don't. I hope that means you can still play a fill there, OR play the actual song. It has to mean something, otherwise they wouldn't make it light up like that, right?

[Blacklight21]

I think a button on one of the Drum Sticks would be cool. That way you don't have to stop what you are doing and just fire it off.

[HazyCloud]

I think a button on one of the Drum Sticks would be cool. That way you don't have to stop what you are doing and just fire it off.

Please for the love of God HMX, don't do this! That darn button would be getting hit at every wrong time.

[ExcessNeo]

I noticed in one of the videos that, right before that note, the whole green lane lights up like it does for regular drum fills. The other lanes don't. I hope that means you can still play a fill there, OR play the actual song. It has to mean something, otherwise they wouldn't make it light up like that, right?

It lights up like that so you know its an optional crash hit, if theres no green trail infront of it, missing will result in a broken combo. Might be a problem in green pad heavy songs.


Please for the love of God HMX, don't do this! That darn button would be getting hit at every wrong time.

This, plus I prefer my anti-vibe sticks to the stock. And batteries are annoying.

[DinoMudd]

I'm glad to see drum fills go away. (Although, to please everyone, I would be in favor of a game modifier to turn them off and on).

Some people, myself included, do not like drum fills. I'd rather hear the songs played as written, than hear random wailing on the drums, or worse, nothing played at all. Also, I feel it is slightly 'unfair' that drummers can receive random resting time during a song, and recover from hard sections. Guitar/Bass players to not get random ad-lib sections, which they can choose not to play. Second, if we are to be 'simulating' playing in a band, it is not real to life that a drummer can simply stop playing for a few measures.

I hope in RB3 there is a game modifier to turn drum fills off.

[LordFlatus]

How about a 2nd pedal to invoke overdrive instead of a tilt-sensor. You know, like to plug into that unused black hole on the back of RB2 kit and kind of look like a hi-hat pedal.

[wickedbadz]

I'm glad to see drum fills go away. (Although, to please everyone, I would be in favor of a game modifier to turn them off and on).

Some people, myself included, do not like drum fills. I'd rather hear the songs played as written, than hear random wailing on the drums, or worse, nothing played at all. Also, I feel it is slightly 'unfair' that drummers can receive random resting time during a song, and recover from hard sections. Guitar/Bass players to not get random ad-lib sections, which they can choose not to play. Second, if we are to be 'simulating' playing in a band, it is not real to life that a drummer can simply stop playing for a few measures.

I hope in RB3 there is a game modifier to turn drum fills off.

There is no Rock Band 3 under development so why you living on a dream? You're getting The Beatles, deal with it.

[DinoMudd]

There is no Rock Band 3 under development so why you living on a dream? You're getting The Beatles, deal with it.

Huh?? Deal with what? I know I'm getting the Beatles. I pre-ordered it on day one. Simply because RB3 hasn't been announced doesn't mean that it should be forbidden to hope for features.

Heck, while you're at it, why don't you reply to all of the "Rock Band 3 Set List" threads out there and tell them the same thing?

[TkDiamonD]

Yeah I noticed this in the trailer as well, I think I'd actually prefer it, it makes the songs much more authentic, and often, more challenging, I kind of hope they go this route for RB3

[Nuff_Said]

drum fills would ruin their classic songs.

one hundred percent

[Grimmja]

Aside from singing, drum fills are the only part where you can have any creative liberties. That's why I like them.

I understand them not being in the Beatles (due to the fact that...well, they're the Beatles), but I would be very disappointed to not see them in RB3.

[Headcase]

I'm glad to see drum fills go away. (Although, to please everyone, I would be in favor of a game modifier to turn them off and on).

The way I'd handle this is an Overdrive option. Turn it off, and you don't get any OD, but you get a small % bonus on any points you get to almost make up for the lack of OD in a way that either option can get you gold stars, but the max score is usually attained through OD being on.

The OD-off bonus points would have to be a little different according to instrument too. Since the lack of drum fills would give an FC more points naturally, drums would need a smaller % bonus, or maybe none at all.

Also, health would have to drain a bit slower since there's no ODs or saves.

While that sounds a bit complicated, for the player(s) it boils down to "do we want to bother with OD or not?".

[IIISZABOIII]

Some people, myself included, do not like drum fills. I'd rather hear the songs played as written, than hear random wailing on the drums, or worse, nothing played at all. Also, I feel it is slightly 'unfair' that drummers can receive random resting time during a song, and recover from hard sections.

I do enjoy the fills, as many times they appear over some of the more difficult fills in the song that cause me to loose my streak. With that said, I do see it as a cheat of sorts, and is the only reason was able to pass Young Man Blues the only time I actually passed the song. Made it past the insane intro and saved overdrive for the rest of the song... 1. to help me in case another insane fill came up and 2. to just give me a small break every few measures. That song is a workout!!!!!

[princeofcups]

I think a button on one of the Drum Sticks would be cool. That way you don't have to stop what you are doing and just fire it off.

I'd like a left foot pedal myself.

[princeofcups]

Aside from singing, drum fills are the only part where you can have any creative liberties. That's why I like them.

I call them rest periods.

[orange_black]

My guess is that Ringo "demanded" the fills be taken out.... as bad as his drumming is, there would 7 year old kids all over the world playing better fills than he ever did.

hehe

[skullpit]

Please please please please please please please please HMX I hope you remove the fills from RB3. I would really prefer to play the chart the way it's supposed to be played.

[Matt LOL]

This is a great idea. No cool parts of songs get taken out and you don't have to do anything ******ed like hit two pads at the same time, taking you completely out of rhythm.

[ArmsAreLoud]

It'll likely be a problem when there are loads of green notes, but meh. Nobody can come up with a good way to activated star power for drums.

[ExcessNeo]

Aside from singing, drum fills are the only part where you can have any creative liberties. That's why I like them.

Creative liberties are for real instruments, you can't change the way a guitar solo sounds on a plastic guitar so why change a fill or part of a normal song into a potentially hideous fill. Often I find that the fills can be slightly off putting so if I'm really focused on a song I'll just kick the bass pedal a few times if I need to activate.

Sure it might make the game harder, but the feeling of satisfaction when you conquer that tricky fill rather than covering it with a overdrive fill will make up for it. You'll become a better drummer.


It'll likely be a problem when there are loads of green notes, but meh. Nobody can come up with a good way to activated star power for drums.

Maybe we will see blue being mapped more to crash2 or perhaps during a large section of green pad hits the overdrive activation hops over to hitting blue (as a second crash).

At least with the Beatles we wont be seeing many crash cymbal fests. And I would say there's going to be a crash "fill" before any snare+floor tom "blasts".

[ADBjester]

Huh?? Deal with what? I know I'm getting the Beatles. I pre-ordered it on day one. Simply because RB3 hasn't been announced doesn't mean that it should be forbidden to hope for features.

Also, because the focus is on TB:RB right now does NOT mean that parallel development on RB3 isn't happening. That's VERY common in the computer industry, from Microsoft and Intel on down -- to have two teams leapfrogging each other with alternating releases. There's a team working on Windows 8 right now, even though Windows 7 isn't done yet. There certainly can be a team working on RB3, while others work on TB:RB.

Jester

[Kidmitt]

So... what about BRE's? Not that I can think of a song that would have one anyway...
Or guitar/drum solos? Is this going to end up a stripped version of a Beatles-themed RB2?

[General Lein979]

So... what about BRE's? Not that I can think of a song that would have one anyway...
Or guitar/drum solos? Is this going to end up a stripped version of a Beatles-themed RB2?Guitar is in you can see one in the trailer and if the beatles have a drum solo it will be in. BRE aren't really there as I know of.

[dragonflyr]

i'm fine with no fill in TB:RB.

regarding RB2 or 3 ... fills are irritating when 1: people just flail randomly and it sounds like crap, and 2: if it introduces lag. I can drum (sorta) in real life, so my fills are pretty good. but when someone else is drumming and they just spaz out during a fill, i friggin hate that.

a fill ON or OFF option would be wonderful!!

another thing i'd LOVE to see as an option (on / off) is the cheesy audio effects they apply during OD or solo, altering the sound a little. sounds like crap, imo.

[Blacklight21]

I'd like a left foot pedal myself.

Or you can hook up the new Wii Vitality Sensor to it so when you get nervous and about to fail it fires off :D

[TVRobot]

even though i dont play drums, id rather see som1 playing the real song (or at least as close to the real song as possible) than just randomly wailing on the drums

[JimmyGrimble]

I call them rest periods.

likewise

[JimmyGrimble]

So... what about BRE's? Not that I can think of a song that would have one anyway...
Or guitar/drum solos? Is this going to end up a stripped version of a Beatles-themed RB2?

I saw a video of Cena playing it with eithe IBite or SomeGuy and im possitive there was a BRE as Cena was strumming like mad and tapping the buttons.

[timmay9]

Who cares? These should be as close to the original songs as possible.

[cdrwizkid]

I'm curious to see how the drums work overall. I love the Beatles and have for years, but I'm sure many will agree that the drums for a majority of their music are not that complicated. If the drums aren't that tough to begin with, will there be much difference between the levels?

[nacho_ar7]

I think the fills are what make rockband so much better than GH, I know it sounds like crap when someone just hits the pads randomly, but that's the reason I've practiced to do better fills. I think the perfect solution is to create a fill "qualifier" that awards you points depending on how good your fill was. That way people will stop resting or killing the song and start spending time on the "fill trainer" and getting better on playing the drums. I don't know how hard to programm that "fill qualifier" is going to be, but I think that's the perfect solution and no doubt it would make the game better.

[T-Hybrid]

How do you evaluate how "good" a fill?

[nacho_ar7]

If it keeps the rhythm, goes with the song,if it's hard to play...I don't know...we all hear when a fill is good or not

[siee]

A tilt sensor would be funny though ;)

LMFAO. I can see it now, that's something only Guitar Hero would come up with!

[liaminh]

Praising Ringo Starr, one drummer to another (http://www.usatoday.com/life/music/news/2009-07-05-ringo-starr_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip)

To this day, producers direct studio drummers to "play like Ringo." Red Hot Chili Peppers drummer Chad Smith sums it up thusly: "The greatest thing a drummer can contribute to a recorded song is the feel of it, and every Beatles song feels great."

Ringo "doesn't dazzle with flashy technique and pyrotechnics," says The Cars' lead guitarist, Elliot Easton. "What he does is so much more elusive and difficult: He plays songs on the drums. Anybody who has sat down behind a drum kit in the last 45 years owes him."

[gamrrpol]

a fill ON or OFF option would be wonderful!!

another thing i'd LOVE to see as an option (on / off) is the cheesy audio effects they apply during OD or solo, altering the sound a little. sounds like crap, imo.

Agree with this wholeheartedly.

I'm kind of amused at all those who claim RB is a "simulator". No, it's not. Simulators are designed to realistically re-create an event, so much so that participants, having trained only on simulators, could potentially pass through the event. You can actually learn to fly a plane through a simulator; it's not ideal but feasible. Under no circumstances could people with no real music skills transfer RB to getting up and actually performing with real instruments.

Simulators don't allow you to pause, start over, play at "medium" or do many of the other elements that RB offers. These are "gaming" elements designed to make playing the game fun. If you want OD fills removed because you want a simulation, then you also want those other options removed as well.

[gamrrpol]

Praising Ringo Starr, one drummer to another (http://www.usatoday.com/life/music/news/2009-07-05-ringo-starr_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip)

To this day, producers direct studio drummers to "play like Ringo." Red Hot Chili Peppers drummer Chad Smith sums it up thusly: "The greatest thing a drummer can contribute to a recorded song is the feel of it, and every Beatles song feels great."

Ringo "doesn't dazzle with flashy technique and pyrotechnics," says The Cars' lead guitarist, Elliot Easton. "What he does is so much more elusive and difficult: He plays songs on the drums. Anybody who has sat down behind a drum kit in the last 45 years owes him."

Hey, he was a member of The Beatles and for that he deserves credit. But to say things like "an ironclad timekeeper who rocked and swung like mad, with style, imagination and versatility. He was the secret weapon of the best band of all time." is simply ludicrous. Good timekeeper? Yep. Rocked and swung like mad? No, not even close to more well-respected jazz, rock and big-band drummers. Imagination? Again, no. He played a pretty generic style. Secret weapon? C'mon....had the Beatles had a different drummer I'm pretty sure they'd still be The Beatles. Had Ringo not had The Beatles, we'd have never heard of him.

That article is a perfect example of a guy with an agenda finding a few other people to make statements supporting his stance and turning it into BIG STATEMENTS OF FACT.

[Vedicardi]

I like it because it removes ugly chokes, but at the same time I love doing my own fills ):

[Aestilion]

Agree with this wholeheartedly.

I'm kind of amused at all those who claim RB is a "simulator". No, it's not. Simulators are designed to realistically re-create an event, so much so that participants, having trained only on simulators, could potentially pass through the event. You can actually learn to fly a plane through a simulator; it's not ideal but feasible. Under no circumstances could people with no real music skills transfer RB to getting up and actually performing with real instruments.

Simulators don't allow you to pause, start over, play at "medium" or do many of the other elements that RB offers. These are "gaming" elements designed to make playing the game fun. If you want OD fills removed because you want a simulation, then you also want those other options removed as well.

as long as you can tell the difference in closed/med/open hi-hats and your rides and crash, you can take the charts (learned hand movements) and apply them to an acoustic set with the same results. ive done this on several songs. as long as youre reading the expert charts and have a somewhat working ear its more of a simulator than i gets credit for. at least thats how i feel. /shrug

[gamrrpol]

as long as you can tell the difference in closed/med/open hi-hats and your rides and crash, you can take the charts (learned hand movements) and apply them to an acoustic set with the same results. ive done this on several songs. as long as youre reading the expert charts and have a somewhat working ear its more of a simulator than i gets credit for. at least thats how i feel. /shrug

I agree drumming on RB is closer to a simulation than any of the other instruments. But, if I understand what you're saying, you play an acoustic set along with songs on RB, watching the screen tell you what to do? If that's what you're doing, try doing it without the screen telling you what to do. That would be a much better test.

Also, as many, many have pointed out, a real drum kit has a second pedal and additional drums that makes it a somewhat different experience from playing the RB kit.

[Jglaubman]

as long as you can tell the difference in closed/med/open hi-hats and your rides and crash, you can take the charts (learned hand movements) and apply them to an acoustic set with the same results. ive done this on several songs. as long as youre reading the expert charts and have a somewhat working ear its more of a simulator than i gets credit for. at least thats how i feel. /shrug

I agree. If you memorize the drum chart on RB and have some knowledge of a drum set, you can play the drum part on a real drum set.

[Dirt008]

I'm glad to see drum fills go away. (Although, to please everyone, I would be in favor of a game modifier to turn them off and on).

Some people, myself included, do not like drum fills. I'd rather hear the songs played as written, than hear random wailing on the drums, or worse, nothing played at all. Also, I feel it is slightly 'unfair' that drummers can receive random resting time during a song, and recover from hard sections. Guitar/Bass players to not get random ad-lib sections, which they can choose not to play. Second, if we are to be 'simulating' playing in a band, it is not real to life that a drummer can simply stop playing for a few measures.

I hope in RB3 there is a game modifier to turn drum fills off.

I think its completely fair that the drummer gets random resting periods. I do expert on both and the drums are way more tiring than the guitar/bass.

[liaminh]

That article is a perfect example of a guy with an agenda finding a few other people to make statements supporting his stance and turning it into BIG STATEMENTS OF FACT.

So you know what this writer's agenda is? Please enlighten us.

Of course, the article is his "opinion" only, not STATEMENT OF FACTS.

Get a clue already...

[Henrico]

This game is going to be soooo sweet!

Found the best price at http://www.rockbandthebeatles.com Rockband The Beatles.

Only 2 months left!!

[princeofcups]

I think its completely fair that the drummer gets random resting periods. I do expert on both and the drums are way more tiring than the guitar/bass.

So do I. But I'd rather have snare misses count for 10% less energy loss instead. That'd be fair.

[liaminh]

Ringo admitted he couldn’t play a roll. A drum roll involves being able to use the rebound of the stick of the head to play more notes, called the "bounce" stroke. It is also how drummers can play "ghost notes," the softer notes that lead up to or fit in between the loud accented notes.

You don’t hear any of that in a Beatles record. Even Charlie Watts plays ghost notes. Not Ringo.

I was pretty sure that I wanted to play more like Joe than Ringo, and I worked at it. Then I went out and looked for work playing drums. That was somewhat of a big letdown. Back then, and where I lived, there weren’t a lot of gigs to be had, and the good paying ones were playing Country music. I’d go out and play with a Country band, and I’d do a fill, maybe a set of sixteenth notes. That’s a bad idea. Just as the Country guitarists would say "there’s no money past the fifth fret" the drummers could have said "nobody needs to play more than a quarter note" (that is, of course, if they knew what a quarter note was).

Somehow I managed to get past my incessant need to play all that fancy stuff and I worked steady. One time, I was playing on the road in a hotel band in South Dakota. A semi-big-time Country (name withheld) artist came into town for a concert at a place called the Corn Palace (what a strange place that is) on my off nights. The drummer was unable to play, and the band’s manager asked me to fill in. The money wasn’t bad, so I said o.k.; I could play a country shuffle (it’s actually a special skill), and it was only one night (at least I figured it would be). Things were going all right, but then I somehow lost control and played a triplet fill on a turnaround. I got "the look"; that means the leader turns his head back and glares at the drummer. I knew immediately that I’d stepped over the line, and I kept it cool after that.

After the first show, the leader came up to me and told me that he liked my playing, but that I had to not play all that "fancy stuff." I told him I understood, but he wanted to make sure. He said, "you know, maybe you could play like that fella, Ringo. He’s just right..."

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/7/7/750876/-Happy-Birthday-RINGO

[nbalive2005]

Ringo admitted he couldn’t play a roll. A drum roll involves being able to use the rebound of the stick of the head to play more notes, called the "bounce" stroke. It is also how drummers can play "ghost notes," the softer notes that lead up to or fit in between the loud accented notes.

You don’t hear any of that in a Beatles record. Even Charlie Watts plays ghost notes. Not Ringo.

I was pretty sure that I wanted to play more like Joe than Ringo, and I worked at it. Then I went out and looked for work playing drums. That was somewhat of a big letdown. Back then, and where I lived, there weren’t a lot of gigs to be had, and the good paying ones were playing Country music. I’d go out and play with a Country band, and I’d do a fill, maybe a set of sixteenth notes. That’s a bad idea. Just as the Country guitarists would say "there’s no money past the fifth fret" the drummers could have said "nobody needs to play more than a quarter note" (that is, of course, if they knew what a quarter note was).

Somehow I managed to get past my incessant need to play all that fancy stuff and I worked steady. One time, I was playing on the road in a hotel band in South Dakota. A semi-big-time Country (name withheld) artist came into town for a concert at a place called the Corn Palace (what a strange place that is) on my off nights. The drummer was unable to play, and the band’s manager asked me to fill in. The money wasn’t bad, so I said o.k.; I could play a country shuffle (it’s actually a special skill), and it was only one night (at least I figured it would be). Things were going all right, but then I somehow lost control and played a triplet fill on a turnaround. I got "the look"; that means the leader turns his head back and glares at the drummer. I knew immediately that I’d stepped over the line, and I kept it cool after that.

After the first show, the leader came up to me and told me that he liked my playing, but that I had to not play all that "fancy stuff." I told him I understood, but he wanted to make sure. He said, "you know, maybe you could play like that fella, Ringo. He’s just right..."

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/7/7/750876/-Happy-Birthday-RINGO

Great post and great link.

[ATrueG]

Wow a tilt for the drums...... Im sorry not even GH would touch that let alone the stick with the button. I actually like the idea of hitting 2 cymbals to acivate SP/OD.

After reading that Ringo cant play a roll...... It really takes a peg away from this game.... If you can't play a sixteenth note then what are you doing to make you music more complicated and elusive?

Anyway..... I hope this game doesn't disappoint.

[Timmerbo]

After reading that Ringo cant play a roll...... It really takes a peg away from this game.... If you can't play a sixteenth note then what are you doing to make you music more complicated and elusive?

Ah, but he did play sixteenth notes. And ghost notes. Daytripper, which isn't a terribly notable song from a drumming standpoint, has both.

[ATrueG]

Im not that intrested in ghost notes... I never really liked that term anyway. Its just playing at a lower stick height followed by a louder hit.... I would like to call them flams instead.

[nbalive2005]

Wow a tilt for the drums...... Im sorry not even GH would touch that let alone the stick with the button. I actually like the idea of hitting 2 cymbals to acivate SP/OD.

After reading that Ringo cant play a roll...... It really takes a peg away from this game.... If you can't play a sixteenth note then what are you doing to make you music more complicated and elusive?

Anyway..... I hope this game doesn't disappoint.

2 cymbal hits ala gh is very very stupid.

think about it, what happens when your in the middle of a long streak of notes that wont stop?