Why Such a Change on the Strum Bar for Guitar?

[B18C5 Tom]

First of all this isn't intended to be a tech support topic.

I just have a general question and a few observations about the Rock Band Fender guitar.

Why such a departure in the strum bar feel from the very popular, very comfortable Guitar Hero strum bar?

Within the first few strums on the new guitar my wife and I looked at each other like "man I hope this thing doesn't break." The strums feel more vague, and the bar itself just feels weaker when compared to the Guitar Hero controllers.

So of course our down strum stopped working, so not only did we file the express replacement, but we went ahead and bought a used Guitar Hero II guitar controller since nobody ever likes to use the Rock Band one due to it's vague strum bar.

The solo buttons are a cool concept, and I really like the fret buttons being more flushed with the neck, but the strum bar seems cheap/poorly designed not only from a feel standpoint, but obviously now also in terms of durability seeing as how it lasted for three weeks.

Anyone else notice the big difference in the strum bar when compared to the Guitar Hero controllers?

Anyone actually like the strum bar batter on Rock Band?

[MrE]

I'm sure it has something to do with patents and HMX not being able to use the GH mechanics

[tbradshaw]

I prefer the strat strum bar. It's more realistic and the nice grip lets me play faster. You can even play it with a pick and it behaves surprisingly well.

[Bakkster]

I prefer the strat strum bar. It's more realistic and the nice grip lets me play faster. You can even play it with a pick and it behaves surprisingly well.

Agreed. I'm still getting used to the trigger being closer to the center of the throw, but that's a small price to pay for a silent strum bar.

It also works great to not flick back and double-strum while finger-picking. I still need to try playing it with a pick...

[el33tcapitan]

I love the Fender strum bar. The less sound my guitar makes when playing, the better. The buttons are louder though, but you swap buttons way less often. I also find the strum bar far easier to hit the fast notes with. I think it's because its displacement is smaller in magnitude than the clicker on the GH guitars.

Fender for life man. That's all I have to say about that.

[Gryffindor]

The first guitar we got with the bundle had the strum bar so tight that it was impossible to hit repetitive notes.

Now that we have the replacement, the strum bar does feel more comfortable but now the buttons make clacking noises.

I do have to say that I do like the buttons on the Strat over the LP as they are closer together which makes the Green/Orange combos a lot easier for those with small hands.

However, I do feel that the faster - repetitive notes could be nailed much easier using the LP due to the strummer being faster.

[Mycool]

I prefer the strat strum bar. It's more realistic and the nice grip lets me play faster. You can even play it with a pick and it behaves surprisingly well.

I agree, the Strat strum bar feels much more like playing a real guitar. I have also tried playing it using a guitar pick and I am getting very quick & accurate results as well. Now that I've grown accustomed to using the Strat, I can't stand playing GH with the Les Paul or Xplorer, I wish that we could use the Strat for the GH series. It really seems absurd that this isn't possible.

[JuiceJive]

The foam that stops the loud click is probably a big factor in the difference in the feel of the strum bars. I think if the original SGs for GH1 had this feature, everyone would be used to it. The click is familiar, and the Strat having a silenced strum bar is not. I liked the feel of the Strat right away. The sensitivity makes fast little twitches effortless. That is, of course, until after a dozen hours of play and I couldn't get it to work right anymore.

I sort of fear getting it replaced. Downstrums work like they should 99.5% of the time. Upstrums mostly hit once on the up, and once again on the return to center, making fast up-and-down strumming and authentic picking on bass completely impossible. That said, my fret buttons are dead silent and smooth (read: PERFECT) and my 2 buddies' Strats make noises that remind us of a quiet NES Zapper trigger. Spring and click sounds. If I get my guitar replaced and the frets suck, I'm gonna cry.

[Parodygm]

I'm very happy with the Strat strum bar, at least since I opened up my guitar and straightened out the contacts. Both the silent strum bar and the flush buttons combine to make it feel considerably less like a toy to me.

One thing that I'm particularly happy about is the tiny amount of force I need to exert on it, especially upstrumming for "Authentic Strummer" bass play. Anyone else love this guitar for bass?

[BodhiWolff]

I too love the new Rock Band guitar, even if it is having some birthing pains.

However, for those that don't, you can look at it this way.

a) if you like the other type of look, feel, and style, there are lots of other guitar options for you out there on the market, both from previous games and from 3rd parties. You are free to pick up another guitar, trade your Rock Band guitar in to help with the price of a different one, etc. Nobody is forcing anybody to play on "their" type of guitar.

b) innovation requires change, and therefore attempts at change must be made occasionally. If nobody ever changed, nothing could ever innovate. If you-in-particular don't like a change, that doesn't mean that everybody doesn't like the change, and doesn't mean that everybody *shouldn't* like the change.

Now, if it so happens that a lot of people don't like it, then the alteration will ultimately fail out, and the experiment goes into the dumpster. Okay, so it goes.

However, if a number of people *do* like the change, then that doesn't mean you are "wrong", and it doesn't threaten you in any way, shape, or form. It just means that the change actually *was* an innovation, and the experiment was a success. You are free to dislike the change - quietly - and prefer the way things used to be - quietly - but remember that you are in danger, with every one of these, of becoming the grandpa who starts telling you why things used to be so much better in the olden days. "Let me tell you why Coleco-vision was far superior to your newfangled games ..."

Thus, "Let me tell you exactly why big coloured buttons and big clicky strum bars on a little toy-sized guitar were better on my old game ..." could be the voice of a person who dislikes a change/experiment that ultimately is failing, or it could be the early-warning signs of the sort of person who is unable to keep up with times, unable to learn the advantages being presented by new innovations, and unable to take advantage of the opportunities being presented to them by new technologies.

Time will tell ...

[ktm450exc]

Like a few of the folks above, I really like the fret buttons on the Strat except for the loud clicking noise. The frets alone are a vast improvement over the LP and GH controllers. I tend to slide my index finger between the green/red frets, which on the Strat works better then the GH/LP controllers.

My issue though is with the strummer. My replacement guitar's strummer is stiffer then the original, and this stiffness doesn't give me the tactile feedback that I like. Sometimes it doesn't feel like I strummed, other times it feels like it's strumming on its own.

I realize that since these controllers were targeted for a certain price point, but a couple things I'd like to see added to the controller are: Strum tension adjustment in the form of a screw or something that would let me adjust the tension it takes to move the strummer. I'd also like to see a light or sometime on the controller that lets me know a strum was made, this could also be tied with a little speaker to make a clicking noise (again with a switch to turn the speaker or LED off).

Over all though, I prefer the Strat to the GH/LP controllers. With the only changes to improve the Strat being a tension adjustment on the strum, make the strummer not feel mushy when it is strummed, and some sort of "feel" that a strum was made.

Not to detract from the topic, but for additional improvements to the Strat I'd like to see the neck's torsional rigidity improved (it twists to easy). I'd like to see the body have more weight, or mass, to it.

[MrNazraq]

The design of the new strumbar took some getting used to, but I'd have to say that I can't go back to the Guitar Hero controllers any more.

The shape of the strumbar lets me grip it like a pick or string. I could never do that with the Guitar Hero guitars since those strumbars are shaped triangular. I found that it's much easier and more natural for me to do alt-strumming now, and I do it much more often as opposed to the GH guitars.

Also, the neck is slimmer, which I really like. The fret buttons are flush, which makes "sliding" between notes (especially chords) much more realistic.

I think HMX made all these changes to try to make the guitar controller more realistic... and I think they did a really good job!

HOORAY for solo buttons!

[HeXcoda]

I LOVE the new fret buttons, I love the solo buttons, I even like the new angle and placement of the whammy bar and as a disabled gamer I'm thrilled to have a nice large SELECT button for Overdrive.

But the strummer's awful. I've tried, and tried, but my scores are just terrible when I use my strat. Having no tactile feedback whatsoever to indicate that I have in fact fully strummed leaves me fumbling about without any rhythm during RB's much more rhythm focused guitar tracks. (You know, same note, same note, same note, same note, rapidly, over and over.)

I've regrettably had to go back to my xplorer. Everything about it is worse, but the strummer is sharp and focused, and that's what keeps me afloat.

[loweredd]

I love my modified Original GH SG. Strummer is tightened up, as well as the buttons. I wish I could use it, but I cant. The buttons are nicer on the Strat, except for the click if you have the volume down, but the strum is POOP.

[The Hungry Samurai]

I'm one of the guys who prefer the new strumbar. It's feels smooth yet firm and I hated the constant clicking of my GH2 guitar. (now reserved for our bands bassist) Don't get me wrong the GH2 guitar felt much more sturdier, perhaps because it felt and looked like a toy (I even let my 6 year old apply the stickers that came with it)

Between the two I prefer the RB guitar.

Which is why I can't wait to get my replacement in the mail! Damn you broken strummer!!!

[capitalfn9]

you give me a working strat and its better than any of the guitars before it.

[Stevenam81]

Yeah, I love the solo buttons. They are a must for solos like the one in Ride the Lightning on expert. Those patterns near the end of the solo are fun when you get in the zone with the finger tapping. I don't know that anyone could pass those parts without them. It's like that solo is harder than just about anything in Guitar Hero 3, except its doable since we have the solo buttons. I guess it could be doable on GH3 considering all you have to do is hit most of the notes in the right order no matter how terrible your timing between notes is and you can still pass the song lol.

I love how precise Rock Band requires us to be on those tapping parts. It was tough at first, but when I got it down it really felt like I was playing it. Oh and I love the fender guitar. I can't go back to the Guitar Hero models. I agree with all the fender compliments above. The thin neck, close, flush buttons, silent strum, thin smooth body, looks....Once they perfect it, it will be in a league of its own.

[B18C5 Tom]

Well I wanted to clarify something too:

I never played Guitar Hero. I wasn't into it because my pinky doesn't cooperate.

I started even messing with the guitar hero-esque stuff once I got Rock Band and played some songs as bass with the old GH controller/Xplorer and then guitar with the Strat controller, so I wasn't even "used to" the feel of the old controller at all.

Just playing them back to back, IMO, the Xplorer strummer feels more positive, albeit clicky. I'm no expert at the bass/guitar portion of this game, so maybe my opinion isn't as qualified as those who are really good at GH and Rock Band Bass/Guitar. Admittedly I'm more of a drummer/singer myself, but even my friends who can beat songs on expert like the Xplorer better for the strum bar.

I agree whole heartedly that the fret buttons are a huge improvement - no doubt. So far everyone I've played with really likes the ability to slide fingers much easier from fret to fret. I personally slide two fingers most of the time to play bass. That's much harder to do on the old Xplorer.

The distrurbing part about this topic is that of the people replying it looks like about half have already experienced a broken/non functioning strum bar - the game hasn't even been out a MONTH!!! I should be getting my replacement guitar tomorrow, so i hope it's not some refurb crap, and I hope it lasts longer than three weeks, or however long it's been since I got it on Thanksgiving Day.

Innovation is fine, but at the cost of durability? No thanks.

I was merely asking why change what isn't broken, and even more ironic is why "fix" something only to make it way less reliable?

;)

[kartingpilot]

I joined just to post how much I love the Strat compared to the X-plorer. As a guitar player, the strat is MUCH more realistic. My strum bar is not stiff at all, and I always use a pick when playing it. Like someone above said - alternate strumming is a breeze and makes all the fast rhythm sections much easier and less forearm-straining then when using the x-plorer. I will say tho that I haven't mastered using the solo buttons yet and when I try the fast metallica-style solos with a pick, I'm not as accurate yet as I am with the x-plorer.

I have not tried using the strat for finger-style for bass but that sounds like a good idea to try.

My only complaint is my guitar came with a screw rattling around somewhere around the base of the neck and I cannot find it to remove it. I tried to take the back off the guitar but it feels like there are a couple of connectors still holding the back on even with all the screws removed and i'm afraid I'll break the plastic if I try too hard.

I also like the raised pieces on the fret to let you know when your hand is all the way to the left or right on th board - makes it easy to know you're in the right position.

After playing the strat lately, it almost hurts my wrist to play the x-plorer so I've started strumming it differently. I just use the tips of my fingers and tap the strummer down (instead of using my thumb). This allows me to keep my wrist straight and I found I can play the fast, rhythmic bass-style lines easier and more accurately.

[surgesnugs]

I prefer the GH strum bar, but I can't go back to GH style frets after playing the Strat. It feels better to me. Plus, on songs like Enter Sandman, the ability to more easily slide between buttons for hammer-ons is almost required for the way I play it. I also use the solo buttons for alot of the more difficult solos.

[AMartin56]

No contest for me between the old GH controllers and the Strat due to one MAJOR thing:

The thick kneck on the GH controllers and the resulting angle of my wrist when I hold it has me in pain after about a half hour...(Damn carpal tunnels!)

I can play the strat for hours with NO issues...