Phantom Drum Beat

[mrtauntaun]

I have recently moved on to hard for drums. The hardest problem I was having was when I'd have to double hit the foot pedal quickly while only hitting one note on the pads. Example:


Green+Pedal, Pedal, Red+Green

In the above, I would ALWAYS hit green every time I hit the pedal. It just felt natural to hit something with the stick while I was using the pedal. Needless to say, this caused me to fail my fair share of songs.

What I did today was incorporate a 'Phantom Drum Beat' so now when I get to that part I hit Green+Pedal, and then the Pedal and just hit air (swing the stick) at the same time. It seems to have worked, and my scores have improved.

Is this good form? I am trying hard to make sure I have good form while playing the drums. I got into a terrible habit of single strumming in guitar hero that I still can't break, so I want to make sure I have good habits starting to drum.

Does anyone else do this?

[Dabog666]

This happens to all beginner drummers (if you are one, sorry if you aren't)

As you practice, you will find yourself getting used to using your hands and feet, and soon enough you will be able to use your right hand and foot independently. It will take some time and practice though.:D

[mrtauntaun]

Sort of a re-beginner, really. I played when I was in middle school, but never made it to the more complex drum kits. But definately more beginner that not :)

Glad to know this will go away with practice. Just gotta keep at it. Is it doing more harm than good using a phantom beat?

[surgesnugs]

One thing that helps me is the way I register the bass beats separately from the hand played beats in my head and try not to think about what those bass beats are paired with.

[mxmarks]

On thing I can NOT do to save my LIFE is the R+G, pedal, R+G, pedal pattern that appears in a ton of songs (He It Goes Again chorus, Roxanne ending, ect...)

I finally got it on Foreplay/Long Time last night on MEDIUM, but thats because its REAL slow when it happens.

So so hard.

[terRize]

On thing I can NOT do to save my LIFE is the R+G, pedal, R+G, pedal pattern that appears in a ton of songs (He It Goes Again chorus, Roxanne ending, ect...)

I finally got it on Foreplay/Long Time last night on MEDIUM, but thats because its REAL slow when it happens.

So so hard.

This is the hardest thing for me as well. Any combination of two pads, pedal, two pads, repeat causes me problems. I spent about an hour practicing that pattern on The Strokes, Reptilia. The best I could get was 60% perfect. At 90% and above it's like my brain just freezes up on me. I ended up getting past it with judicious use of overdrive thankfully. I'll probably practice it again when I get home as I see that pattern happening a lot more in the hard tier.

The thing I'm liking is that the songs do seem to be teaching you something as you move up the tiers and then difficulties. For example, on medium you see the repeating yellow with red added sometimes. As you move up they add in the bass pedal and speed it up. Finally you get to GG&HT where it should all pay off (or you just get annoyed and throw your drumsticks which is an acceptable alternative in my book). =)

I'm also having problems doing quick double kicks.

[Parodygm]

One thing that helps me is to not actively pay attention to the bass pedal notes. I focus on the pad notation and kind of take in the bass kicks out of the corner of my eye. I find that it helps quite a lot. There's definitely times when I "overthink" trying to follow the note chart instead of feeling the rhythm more naturally.

[Rogue42]

On thing I can NOT do to save my LIFE is the R+G, pedal, R+G, pedal pattern that appears in a ton of songs (He It Goes Again chorus, Roxanne ending, ect...)

I finally got it on Foreplay/Long Time last night on MEDIUM, but thats because its REAL slow when it happens.

So so hard.

This threw me for a day or so, but I've sort of picked up a technique that works for me: moving my body with the alternating pedal & pad hits. When hitting just the pads, I lean back a little bit and flick my wrists down for the pad hits. Then I transition to leaning forward a bit, bringing my foot down for the kick pedal and moving my wrists up, safely away from the pads, almost pretending to hit pads above my shoulders. It probably looks really goofy, but it feels very natural, now.

[shoombabi]

When I first started, those alternating double-hit/bass pedal (like you said, Here It Goes Again has a great example of it) used to give me serious trouble. What I found that works is that you sort of rock in your chair. Make every movement deliberate. Lean forward and hit the pedal. As you release the pedal, lean back a bit (use your tailbone as a fulcrum) and raise your shoulders to hit the pads. It's kind of like a truncated rowing motion.

[CowboyGP]

I think the phantom beat could come back to bite you down the road.

I still have some problems with this, but it's gotten much better over the past week or so.

I've actually found that I can seperate the bass line (in my head) from the pads when needed. What I mean is; during sections like Y, Y+O, Y I used to hit the pedal at least twice during that phrase. Or during R+B+O, O, R+B I had a tough time stopping my right hand from hitting Blue in the middle. Now I've found a way to groove seperately on the bass beat and still follow the other notes as though the pedal wasn't even there.

I can only do it for short sections at a time, but usually that's all that's needed. Hopefully this is a sign that it'll become more intuitive as I gain experience.

I think the growing pains are worthwhile, and special tricks to "fake" your way through might have to be unlearned later. And as you and I both know from our single-strum problem, its much harder to unlearn something once it's become second nature.

[Zzzingy]

Im not bad at medium - but on hard - and some mediums - my foot can NOT hit that fast!

What IS the proper form for the foot pedal? Always have it pressed and come up for the beats? Always have your foot raised and hit them and always up at rest?

Will my foot muscles eventually learn to flex faster? I dont see myself ever getting past medium :(

[sporkBrigade]

A lot of these foot/hand things are super easy to practice away from the drums. In my opinion, it's all about muscle memory. The more you practice as your sitting at work/school the better off you'll be. Just memorize one repeating pattern from the game, and tap it out every chance you get as you go through your day. Then choose another pattern you're having problems with, repeat. That's my best suggestion.

As for the OPs question, I'm scared by this phantom hit. I think you'll be better served focusing on trying to cut that connection from your right hand to right foot. I suppose maybe with time, the need for your phantom beat will go away. But it's very very important you be able to do multiple bass pedal beats seperate from your hands, or else future songs will become very hard for you to complete.

[mrtauntaun]

Thanks for the advice guys, I'll got back and try it without the phantom beat. Don't want to pick up bad habits now. I don't care what Yoda says, I can't unlearn what I have learned :)

[surgesnugs]

One thing that helps me is to not actively pay attention to the bass pedal notes. I focus on the pad notation and kind of take in the bass kicks out of the corner of my eye. I find that it helps quite a lot. There's definitely times when I "overthink" trying to follow the note chart instead of feeling the rhythm more naturally.

That actually perfectly describes what I do as well. It's like one part of my brain is concentrating on the pads and the other part the pedal.

[CowboyGP]

That actually perfectly describes what I do as well. It's like one part of my brain is concentrating on the pads and the other part the pedal.

ding ding ding!!! Ditto!!

[Dabog666]

Sort of a re-beginner, really. I played when I was in middle school, but never made it to the more complex drum kits. But definately more beginner that not :)

Glad to know this will go away with practice. Just gotta keep at it. Is it doing more harm than good using a phantom beat?

You might want to try to leave out these phantom beats, and eventually you will find yourself getting the pattern right.

Alternatively, you could try it in practice mode at the lowest speed until you've got it, and even if you can't get it any faster, at least you'll have your foundations laid. :D

[Paradox]

Im not bad at medium - but on hard - and some mediums - my foot can NOT hit that fast!

What IS the proper form for the foot pedal? Always have it pressed and come up for the beats? Always have your foot raised and hit them and always up at rest?

Will my foot muscles eventually learn to flex faster? I dont see myself ever getting past medium :(

a lot of that depends on the pattern of the song, for me.

It isn't really capable of being described here, but some songs I will keep my heel up for some parts, some parts it will be down. SOme songs are all down for me and some songs have so many double kicks and weird patterns that its almost always up.

Its a feel thing that you'll get used to. I go from having my heel down to up and back down again in one short pattern on some songs, just depends on how I have to use the pedal. There is no "proper form" really because its all about what allows you to play the best possible way. If you work better heel down, then you should do that and get good at it, you can use my "hybrid" which I guess most people do use, or you can go all out heel up.

[Zzzingy]

some songs I will keep my heel up for some parts, some parts it will be down. SOme songs are all down for me and some songs have so many double kicks and weird patterns that its almost always up.

So your leg and foot are hovering the whole time and you are tapping the pedal with the front of your foot?

Or are you turning around your pedal and leaving your toes on the ground and using your heal on the thing? :)

[LoneSteele]

On thing I can NOT do to save my LIFE is the R+G, pedal, R+G, pedal pattern that appears in a ton of songs (He It Goes Again chorus, Roxanne ending, ect...)

I finally got it on Foreplay/Long Time last night on MEDIUM, but thats because its REAL slow when it happens.

So so hard.

I'm the same! I always fail at that part on Reptilia on hard! What I've started doing, and it seems to help a little, is watch for the first couple notes, then not even look at the screen, i just play as i hear the beat. Seems to have helped a bit, I'm still working on it.

[logicalnoise]

I do the phantom beat but I just use my non BD foot. I'm a few teirs in on expert.

[Rogue42]

Or are you turning around your pedal and leaving your toes on the ground and using your heal on the thing? :)

This is actually the way I do it, though I recommend getting an 1/8 inch extension cable, as the flexi-cable would get rather annoying banging against your leg.

[Paradox]

So your leg and foot are hovering the whole time and you are tapping the pedal with the front of your foot?

Or are you turning around your pedal and leaving your toes on the ground and using your heal on the thing? :)

No, not hovering..regardless if my heel is up or down, the pedal is always already about 3/4 of the way in, if that makes sense. I never "tap" the pedal as I'm always on it,...it just depends on the song whether I am using my whole foot on the pedal or just the front half, or the "ball" of my foot. Hovering will wear you out.

Turning the pedal around..I dunno how that would even work :)

[Yorchi117]

it helps if you sing the part in your head as well...with lots of practice you learn your own little techniques for seperating notes and you dont just act out by hitting colors