Beatles Rock Band re. Dreamscapes

[l-o-t]

Not looking for answers. Just something to think about.

Right. So, They look awsome. I think we can all agree on that. But what I was wondering was if the dreamscapes would change at all if you play the same song more than once. I know it will be the same sort of footage.
Example, I am the Walrus will always have the Beatles dressed in scary animal costumes and John on the piano. But every time you play that song will the video clips be presented in the same order?
I just don't want the game to get visually boring, you know. Obviously, even if there is no change in dreamscape footage, it will still be amazing the first few times you see it but over time... you see what I'm getting at?


Also, Come Together Dreamscape?---> http://mimicimage.deviantart.com/art/The-Beatles-Flash-51483227
This would be sweet in better character animation.

[Scapegoat]

I think they will be the same every time - though I'm not sure.

Are the music videos in RB2 the same every time? Either way they don't change much.

Even though the normal stage performances in RB2 are different, it's hard to see the difference from one time to another, most of the shots and moves are repeated often between songs so it's hard to remember songs as standing out.

[jdrager]

I kind of worry about this too. Anyone who has played "Beat It" (or most songs really) on GH:WT can see how they have set footage for the band to do. In Beat It, the singer always does the same MJ dance.

And for a song were having a special dance is not as warranted, in Low (TB Remix) for GH:WT, the singer(if not everyone) always does the same actions

[DanteSparda504]

I kind of worry about this too. Anyone who has played "Beat It" (or most songs really) on GH:WT can see how they have set footage for the band to do. In Beat It, the singer always does the same MJ dance.

And for a song were having a special dance is not as warranted, in Low (TB Remix) for GH:WT, the singer(if not everyone) always does the same actions

I love Beat It, It gets me how awesome the singer is everytime I play it.

Also even though its always the same animations over and over, seeing Metallica on stage in GH Metallica still gets me also, especially after the solo in Fuel when James steps back up to the mic, I love watching that part for some reason.

[MostSpartan14]

That's why I hate watching Guitar Hero. They usually do more unique things than Rock Band characters but it's the same every time unlike Rock Band. I hope this doesn't happen for TB:RB.

[cherokeesam]

Of course it's going to be the same visuals every time. A lot of the dreamscapes and "live" venues are based on actual Beatles footage (e.g., the "Walrus" video and the Rooftop concert) and have been shown in the demos to play out exactly as they did in real life.

That's another strike against the game's replay value in my book. Same song + same band + same costumes + same venue/dreamscape every. frickin'. time will get old real quick.

[mva5580]

I may not be obsessed with Rock Band 1/2 like most others here to the point of having every single song/movement/etc memorized, but having played both of them a pretty good amount I don't really understand what the difference is? Rock Band 1/2 have a ton of the same animations as well, all used in different songs. 99% of the time it's a song where a female is the singer, she does that little thing where she puts 1 arm above her head and moves it from side to side while singing. If you're the guitarist, the camera is on you moving your head from side to side while playing. And it all goes from there. Sure there are random stage dives here and there, or a few little things where the guitarist/singer will do a combined animation with each other, but to make it sound like it's a part of the game that is hugely varied and offers something new a lot is not the case.

And if there are unique dreamscapes for each Beatles song after the concert years, that's a pretty good amount of unique dreamscapes. Plus who knows what they're doing with the DLC? I guess I understand the question, but to say it hurts the replay value of TB where as it's a-ok in the original Rock Band 1/2 is inaccurate. It's not like this is something that's overwhelmingly great in Rock Band. I like the way they move/look compared to the GH series, definitely. But I don't think it has the variation you're making it sound like it does.

[Skittles]

I kind of worry about this too. Anyone who has played "Beat It" (or most songs really) on GH:WT can see how they have set footage for the band to do. In Beat It, the singer always does the same MJ dance.

And for a song were having a special dance is not as warranted, in Low (TB Remix) for GH:WT, the singer(if not everyone) always does the same actions
also, on Old Time Rock and Roll they pay tribute to Risky Business by having the singer dance like Tom Cruise, which I found hilarious haha

[LinkStrifeLeonhart]

also, on Old Time Rock and Roll they pay tribute to Risky Business by having the singer dance like Tom Cruise, which I found hilarious haha

I think you mean they pay tribute to themselves by having the singer dance like all of those celebrities in the GH commercials.

I was always under the impression that the dreamscape wouldn't start if your band was doing poorly. When I think about that now, I realize how silly that sounds.

[MostSpartan14]

I was also worried about this so I did a little searching and found two different videos for Here Comes the Sun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei2BKhuWZ6A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5dGTE-yZE
If you look at them, even though they are generally showing the same the same thing, there are different camera angles and scenes at times which is really good news. Plus, this is only the E3 demo so they could become more varied by the time the game comes out.

You can see that they're also different in I Am the Walrus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I2grdjuPTE&feature=related (3 minutes in)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSOTLuJyxME

[IErrantVentureI]

I was also worried about this so I did a little searching and found two different videos for Here Comes the Sun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei2BKhuWZ6A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5dGTE-yZE
If you look at them, even though they are generally showing the same the same thing, there are different camera angles and scenes at times which is really good news. Plus, this is only the E3 demo so they could become more varied by the time the game comes out.

You can see that they're also different in I Am the Walrus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I2grdjuPTE&feature=related (3 minutes in)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSOTLuJyxME

Thank you for easing our fears!

[l-o-t]

I was also worried about this so I did a little searching and found two different videos for Here Comes the Sun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei2BKhuWZ6A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5dGTE-yZE
If you look at them, even though they are generally showing the same the same thing, there are different camera angles and scenes at times which is really good news. Plus, this is only the E3 demo so they could become more varied by the time the game comes out.

You can see that they're also different in I Am the Walrus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I2grdjuPTE&feature=related (3 minutes in)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSOTLuJyxME

Hey! alright! kay.this makes me feel a little better.Of course I didn't expect that they'd change the BG graphics completely but This is much better than same camera angles and scenes every time. Thanks for looking!

[GloiGloi]

Oh that's great. I wasn't expecting that.

[cherokeesam]

I may not be obsessed with Rock Band 1/2 like most others here to the point of having every single song/movement/etc memorized, but having played both of them a pretty good amount I don't really understand what the difference is? Rock Band 1/2 have a ton of the same animations as well, all used in different songs. 99% of the time it's a song where a female is the singer, she does that little thing where she puts 1 arm above her head and moves it from side to side while singing. If you're the guitarist, the camera is on you moving your head from side to side while playing. And it all goes from there. Sure there are random stage dives here and there, or a few little things where the guitarist/singer will do a combined animation with each other, but to make it sound like it's a part of the game that is hugely varied and offers something new a lot is not the case.

And if there are unique dreamscapes for each Beatles song after the concert years, that's a pretty good amount of unique dreamscapes. Plus who knows what they're doing with the DLC? I guess I understand the question, but to say it hurts the replay value of TB where as it's a-ok in the original Rock Band 1/2 is inaccurate. It's not like this is something that's overwhelmingly great in Rock Band. I like the way they move/look compared to the GH series, definitely. But I don't think it has the variation you're making it sound like it does.


In RB2, there are four distinct animation styles for each character: Rock, Goth, Punk and Metal. The animation for each song is dependent on four things: (a) the Attitude of your character (i.e., Rock/Goth/Punk/Metal), (b) the gender of your character, (c) the size of the venue (you get different animations depending on whether you're playing in a tiny club or a huge arena -- which gives your character more room to maneuver), and (d) the "built-in" animations for the song that are keyed during specific song phrases.

That leaves a lot of variables. In RB2, it's rarely the same song twice: you can play in different venues, with different characters, with different attitudes, with different costumes, etc etc etc.

In TBRB, you'll play as exactly the same Fab Four, in exactly the same venue/scape every time, with exactly the same animation for that song every time. It's like watching the same music video over and over and over again.

[cherokeesam]

I was also worried about this so I did a little searching and found two different videos for Here Comes the Sun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei2BKhuWZ6A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5dGTE-yZE
If you look at them, even though they are generally showing the same the same thing, there are different camera angles and scenes at times which is really good news. Plus, this is only the E3 demo so they could become more varied by the time the game comes out.

You can see that they're also different in I Am the Walrus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5I2grdjuPTE&feature=related (3 minutes in)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSOTLuJyxME


Where do you see different "scenes" in those videos? Still the same costumes, same venues, same animations. The *only* thing that changes slightly is the camera angle, which will apparently be random.

A very pretty game. It'll be fun for a few playthroughs, but after that, the sameness will get oppressively monotonous.

[The Hungry Samurai]

As much as I love all the bells and whistles and venues and dreamscapes I've always just considered the background imagery icing on an already awesome cake.

Dreamscapes are freakin awesome but you could make the stage antics completely randomized and that wouldn't give the game replayability.

The sound and popularity of Beatles music gives it replayability.

The DLC gives it replayability.

The ability to socialize and play with 6 people at a time gives it replayability.

I'd say the challenge of the songs will give it replayability too but I haven't had the opportunity to test that yet.

I don't know why everyone comes to these forums to crap over the game for so many perceieved flaws so prematurely.

Go play through a tier 5-7 song on expert on rock band twice and tell me the differences in your characters performance beyond the songs intro. NOONE playing at their appropriate difficulty level has enough time to really pay that much attention to the stuff behind the note track.

[mva5580]

In RB2, there are four distinct animation styles for each character: Rock, Goth, Punk and Metal. The animation for each song is dependent on four things: (a) the Attitude of your character (i.e., Rock/Goth/Punk/Metal), (b) the gender of your character, (c) the size of the venue (you get different animations depending on whether you're playing in a tiny club or a huge arena -- which gives your character more room to maneuver), and (d) the "built-in" animations for the song that are keyed during specific song phrases.

That leaves a lot of variables. In RB2, it's rarely the same song twice: you can play in different venues, with different characters, with different attitudes, with different costumes, etc etc etc.

In TBRB, you'll play as exactly the same Fab Four, in exactly the same venue/scape every time, with exactly the same animation for that song every time. It's like watching the same music video over and over and over again.

I don't mean the character I make specifically, I'm talking about the other characters on stage along with me. And considering the fact that the ONLY character I ever make in the game is actually someone who kind of looks like a Beatle, it really doesn't bother me any. But whenever I play, I can almost predict before the song even starts who is going to be on stage with me. If it's a female singing, it's either the thin girl with longer brown hair, or the shorter girl w/ glasses and the leopard bikini. If it's a male singing and it's an older song, it's most likely gonna be the guy with long gray hair and a mustache. And a lot of times the other guitar player is the black guy w/ the face paint and strange uniform.

It's just a fundamental differing of views, and that's fine. Like you mention the goth/punk/metal choices for creating a character, and I would NEVER even for a second consider making a character with those styles. The only one I would ever use is rock. And I think all of the characters in the game who wear shoulder pads, have crazy face paint, spiky hair, etc, I think they look ridiculous. Things like that do more to take me "out" of the game/performance than anything else in there. Most of them are way too over the top and just look dumb. In my opinion of course. And this is supposed to be Rock "Band," but whenever you go through the career mode it's different people almost every other song. Why can't you customize all of the band members so it's consistent throughout the entire thing?

See you probably prefer that it's different, you want to see all the different characters/animation in the game. And that's fine. But that's not me. I think it should be all the same band members throughout the entire thing and as it goes along, you can customize their look, just like you can yours. But it should always be the same people. So the thing you have an issue with in TB:RB is something I love about it. Where as some ridiculous looking avatars sing some great songs in that game, in TB:RB I'm ALWAYS going to have Paul McCartney, John Lennon, George Harrison, and Ringo Starr singing classic Beatles songs. And that's the way it should be.

To me at least. You think differently, and that's fine. But me, as a massive Beatles fan, I couldn't play their songs with some of those ridiculous Rock Band avatars singing them. It just wouldn't be right.

[cherokeesam]

And this is supposed to be Rock "Band," but whenever you go through the career mode it's different people almost every other song. Why can't you customize all of the band members so it's consistent throughout the entire thing?



Um....you *can* customize all of the band members so they're consistent.....:cool:

You *do* realize that you can create up to 24 characters per band? That you can mix and match as you like? That you don't have to use the pre-gen stand-ins at all....???

My own personal style is that I enjoy the hell out of recreating actual rock bands through the ages. I've got my own Beatles, my own Stones, The Who, Zeppelin, Chili Peppers, Metallica, Iron Maiden, Muse, KISS, Police, etc etc. (I'm currently "touring" with Lynyrd Skynyrd.)

I *never* play with the pre-gen characters. All my bands and all my characters are home-grown.

[nbalive2005]

In RB2, there are four distinct animation styles for each character: Rock, Goth, Punk and Metal. The animation for each song is dependent on four things: (a) the Attitude of your character (i.e., Rock/Goth/Punk/Metal), (b) the gender of your character, (c) the size of the venue (you get different animations depending on whether you're playing in a tiny club or a huge arena -- which gives your character more room to maneuver), and (d) the "built-in" animations for the song that are keyed during specific song phrases.

That leaves a lot of variables. In RB2, it's rarely the same song twice: you can play in different venues, with different characters, with different attitudes, with different costumes, etc etc etc.

In TBRB, you'll play as exactly the same Fab Four, in exactly the same venue/scape every time, with exactly the same animation for that song every time. It's like watching the same music video over and over and over again.

Damn your really trying to nitpick EVERYTHING about The Beatles game, you've already said your peace you dont need to drag it into every Beatles thread.

It will probably be the same all the time with just minimal changes but tell me how many times have you watched the entirety of the video(background) while playing the game? It's normal to glance here and there occasionally but its not like all you'll be doing is watching the background, oh wait you probably will because you just want to see everything bad about the game.

Its so painfully obvious.

[elitemastersam]

Hell, I don't mind watching the same animations over and over again. I have watched music videos on youtube over and over again. And I can't even count the times I've watched the footage of the Beatles performing on the Apple rooftop. I'm going to enjoy watching that performance recreated in the game, over and over again, even though most of the time I'll be too focused on the note path of the instrument I'm playing. The same goes with the other performances in-game.

[PCTraitor]

Where do you see different "scenes" in those videos? Still the same costumes, same venues, same animations. The *only* thing that changes slightly is the camera angle, which will apparently be random.

A very pretty game. It'll be fun for a few playthroughs, but after that, the sameness will get oppressively monotonous.

What are you new to this game genre or something? Do you get sick of every single song looking essentially the same in Rock Band and GH? Not really because you pretty much just watch the note chart.

You know what will happen is you'll play the song a dozen times and not notice the background because you're looking at the note chart. Then after you've memorized the note chart you'll start to be able to look around and you'll notice how pretty it is. Then you'll buy DLC and start all over again. Unlike the majority of GH games this game will have DLC>

[karaokefreak]

yeah, I don't know what the fuzz is all about. THe BG graphics are just a kind of "bonus" to the gamer. I never really pay attention to the graphics unless there is a pause in my note-highway. Hard to see anything else but the highway as soon as you play on expert.

And if you don't buy the game because you don't like to see the stages and dreamscapes repeat, well, then you did not want to have that game in the first place, because it is actually the most minor part of the game to complain about...

I think the dreamscapes and everything else look fabulous and will be good enough for a long time.

There are other things to complain about, like the missing export function or missing drumfills. But not even that will make the game bad!

[frankieman]

What goes on in the background is something to enjoy for the people who might be watching while you play the game or indeed when there is a long pause in the note highway.

Sometimes when I know a song's chart really well I might look at what's going on in the easy parts but I'm never paying much attention to the background because most of the animations are random and happen in a lot of songs. In this game however they're special for every song, at least the dreamscapes as far we know.

Even when I'm watching vids of the game being played, I mostly pay attention to the chart.

[cherokeesam]

Damn your really trying to nitpick EVERYTHING about The Beatles game, you've already said your peace you dont need to drag it into every Beatles thread.

It will probably be the same all the time with just minimal changes but tell me how many times have you watched the entirety of the video(background) while playing the game? It's normal to glance here and there occasionally but its not like all you'll be doing is watching the background, oh wait you probably will because you just want to see everything bad about the game.

Its so painfully obvious.

As I've said before: Fake Jukebox Mode.
Part of the appeal of RB2 for me is in making bands...specifically, re-creating actual bands, like The Who (my faves), The Stones, and, yep, The Beatles. And it's cool as hell to see "them" actually "playing" a song, whether it be in the background (whenever I get a chance to see them) or just kicking back and watching them in Fake Juke.

And yeah, I'm not happy at all with the way HMX is abandoning their principles for this game, but I'm not *wishing* it to fail. I'm *pointing out* the little details that will make your average non-Beatlemaniac gamer decide that TBRB is a rent, rather than a buy.

There are so many more ways to make this game have a lasting replay value by simply making it more RB-like. I just can't believe TBRB's developers don't see that, don't use that.

[cherokeesam]

What are you new to this game genre or something? Do you get sick of every single song looking essentially the same in Rock Band and GH? Not really because you pretty much just watch the note chart.

You know what will happen is you'll play the song a dozen times and not notice the background because you're looking at the note chart. Then after you've memorized the note chart you'll start to be able to look around and you'll notice how pretty it is. Then you'll buy DLC and start all over again. Unlike the majority of GH games this game will have DLC>

Every single song *doesn't* look essentially the same in RB because you've got, let's see, (a) different venues every time, (b) different characters every time, (c) different costumes every time, (d) different Attitudes mean different animations every time, (e) different *sized* venues mean different animations every time.

In RB, it *never* looks the same way twice. I can play one song all day and have it be a different visual experience/atmosphere *every* time.

With TBRB, you'll get (a) a new camera angle every time, and....um....well. Same venue, same characters, same costumes, same animations.

Again, that's obviously not going to be a dealbreaker for 99.9% of prospective gamers to prevent them from buying the game. It *will*, however, make a great many of them decide it's a short-term rent from Blockbuster instead of worth investing 60 bucks.

[frankieman]

The difference in the RB or GH backgrounds between mutiple plays of a song are so small most people don't even notice. There are always some 'outstanding' parts which can happen in any song(like a stage slide for a big solo) and special animations in specific songs(like the smashing up guitar in Let There Be Rock and one of the Who songs) but these are only small bits while the rest is very similair to every song.

Sometims I use the fake jukebox feature too and then play like two or three songs in a row and I can't even tell the difference between the preformance of one song or the other apart from these bits I was just talking about. It's just three guys walking around on stage with guitars and a mic and one guy behind the drums.

What disturbs me about those random preformances in RB is the strange transitions between these bits, like at one moment the singer takes a stage dive and a second later he's back on the stage with his tambourine or smaller things like when one of the characters is on the left side of the stage and in the next frame he's on the right side without any movement. That's not gonna happen in TBRB.

[solidsnakejt]

[QUOTE=MostSpartan14;2704386]I was also worried about this so I did a little searching and found two different videos for Here Comes the Sun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei2BKhuWZ6A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5dGTE-yZE
If you look at them, even though they are generally showing the same the same thing, there are different camera angles and scenes at times which is really good news. Plus, this is only the E3 demo so they could become more varied by the time the game comes out.



mmmm, they seem pretty identical to me....

[Kidmitt]

Well, maybe we'll get a Select Dreamscape feature in quickplay, like the Select Venue in RB2. Then we're not stuck with the same background every time we do a song.

(Big maybe. The Octopus Garden dreamscape would look really out of place on another song :) )

[SatansBestBuddy]

Can we please wait for the game to actually get released before we start nitpicking it to death?

[osteofight]

Oh hai actual information, nice to meet you (from here (http://wii.ign.com/articles/100/1005087p2.html)):

IGN: These seem to be very scripted events. Are there ever any variations or when you play, say, Yellow Submarine, will it always plays out in the exact same way?

Dare Matheson: First off we haven't announced if Yellow Submarine is in the game so you'll just have to wait to find out if that's a dreamscape. But to answer your question, the dreamscapes are scripted, so it isn't like if you do extra well one time in Octopus' Garden, you'll see the guys ride off on an octopus. However, there are varying elements within each level. There will be subtle differences in how they interact with the camera and each other upon replay. Also, the camera shots themselves have variation, so with some of the dreamscapes you'll see different areas of the level revealed when you reload it.

And bonus:

IGN: Will the other songs from the studio days being released as DLC have custom dreamscapes?

Dare Matheson: Yes.

[l-o-t]

Awesome!^