Questions About RBN

[JPSChampagne]

(Sorry if there's a thread in which these questions would be more appropriately asked - please lock and remove if this is not the place to post this.)

I haven't come across these particular questions yet about this great new innovation for Rock Band. I'm posting this in hopes that someone from HMX will answer, or that someone from the community will know.

Will the songs be playable in practice mode? If so, will they be required to be broken up into sections, and will you be able to decrease their speed like current releases?

Is there going to be any type of quality control with the character animations? I can see that getting lost in the shuffle of charting critique. Also - will the songs be required to be functional with the stage kit? Will there be any kind of quality control with that?

Will the songs be measured on the leaderboards? Will each of the thousands and thousands of songs likely to be released on RBN each have their own scoring page like current, Harmonix releases do?

Will album art (and information) and song previews be included with these songs? Will they be displayed in the song menu with the normal DLC icon, or will they have a different one?

Basically - are these songs going to be required to have the exact same functionality and quality as current DLC releases? I can see it being a black eye to the entire operation if, while the songs are charted correctly and play correctly, the character animations, lighting effects, and in-game functionality are ruined.

[Meatmuppet]

yes

[trg007]

They've said that the songs are supposed to be equivalent in every way to the ones released by HMX. As for whether there will be leaderboards for every new song, that's a good question...

[Apples]

They have specifically said that artists can include their own album art and song details. (such as year, genre, etc)

[dlowell]

Very good questions, I would especially like to know if the stage kit is going to work. woohoo lights, fog & seizures!

[DavidRS]

(Sorry if there's a thread in which these questions would be more appropriately asked - please lock and remove if this is not the place to post this.)

There is a discussion thread in the Community's Greatest Hits section.

I haven't come across these particular questions yet about this great new innovation for Rock Band. I'm posting this in hopes that someone from HMX will answer, or that someone from the community will know.

Will the songs be playable in practice mode? If so, will they be required to be broken up into sections, and will you be able to decrease their speed like current releases?

I have no idea on it, but I would think they have to be charted to a similar, if not the same, standard as HMX charts.

Is there going to be any type of quality control with the character animations? I can see that getting lost in the shuffle of charting critique. Also - will the songs be required to be functional with the stage kit? Will there be any kind of quality control with that?

Again, no idea on this, but the theory above still holds.

Will the songs be measured on the leaderboards? Will each of the thousands and thousands of songs likely to be released on RBN each have their own scoring page like current, Harmonix releases do?

That is a question I cannot answer, but I would think it would be possible. It would just need a really beefy database server to provide it.

Will album art (and information) and song previews be included with these songs? Will they be displayed in the song menu with the normal DLC icon, or will they have a different one?

Album art will appear on the store, so I expect it will in the game. Song previews would be similar. As for the icon, I'm hoping for a different one, but not expecting it.

Basically - are these songs going to be required to have the exact same functionality and quality as current DLC releases? I can see it being a black eye to the entire operation if, while the songs are charted correctly and play correctly, the character animations, lighting effects, and in-game functionality are ruined.

As I said above, I am under the impression that all songs released on RBN must be authored to the HMX standards, and it is up to the XNA community to ensure those standards are upheld.

Disclaimer: I do not work for HMX, and living in Australia, will have no access to RBN when it goes live. These are all guesses, and if an HMXer comes in and tells you that I'm full of bull****, then that's the case.

Hope that answers your questions.

[JPSChampagne]

Thanks for all the replies, everybody. Good community here. Just hoping that my stage kit isn't gonna go to waste. haha. Hopefully there will be some kind of word about the leaderboards, as that's a huge undertaking.

[davidshek]

Will album art (and information) and song previews be included with these songs? Will they be displayed in the song menu with the normal DLC icon, or will they have a different one?

To this point specifically: Yes, there will be album art, it's part of what Magma packages up into the DLC file that you submit to XNA.

As for previews, you get MORE than current DLC. There will be not only the normal 30-second preview (and yes, the author of the track gets to pick which 30 seconds of the song are the preview), but there will also be a FREE 1-minute (or 35%, whichever comes first) downloadable demo of every song in the RBN Store. This one is the first minute (or 35%) of the song, not changeable.

[JPSChampagne]

Wow, I hadn't heard the 35% thing. That's really cool. It's really looking like HMX is dead serious about quality content being delivered through this. Very reassuring.

[Apples]

Just hoping that my stage kit isn't gonna go to waste. haha. Hopefully there will be some kind of word about the leaderboards, as that's a huge undertaking.

As I understand it, the stage kit goes off of the lighting cues scripted in each song.

So in theory it should work, because the RBN kit will allow you to customize lighting, animations, etc.

Note: This is purely conjecture on my part based on observation.

[HMXEnosity]

1 - Will the songs be playable in practice mode? If so, will they be required to be broken up into sections, and will you be able to decrease their speed like current releases?
2 - Is there going to be any type of quality control with the character animations? I can see that getting lost in the shuffle of charting critique. Also - will the songs be required to be functional with the stage kit? Will there be any kind of quality control with that?
3 - Will album art (and information) and song previews be included with these songs?
4 - Will they be displayed in the song menu with the normal DLC icon, or will they have a different one?


I can answer a few of these questions:

1 - yes

2 - don't worry about this. peer review will catch any animation issues. actually the animation part of charting is really really simple and easy to use.

3 - yes

4 - RBN dlc has a different icon / category. RBN dlc and regular dlc are separate entities.

also for the curious, authoring cameras / lighting is completely optional. If you don't author the camera and lighting it will be auto-generated for you. I personally love doing the camera and lighting chart. gives the songs that personal touch.

[HeyRiles]

also for the curious, authoring cameras / lighting is completely optional. If you don't author the camera and lighting it will be auto-generated for you. I personally love doing the camera and lighting chart. gives the songs that personal touch.

I had one question about that - is the animation going to remain good if it's auto-generated? Meaning, are there going to be any situations where the singer jumps into the crowd and appears on stage instantly after, like in Here It Goes Again (I think? It may have been a different RB1 song)?

[thirdmortal]

As I understand it, the stage kit goes off of the lighting cues scripted in each song.

So in theory it should work, because the RBN kit will allow you to customize lighting, animations, etc.

Note: This is purely conjecture on my part based on observation.

I thought I read somewhere that the stage kit gets its info from the rumble data. So I would assume you would need to chart information into an additional track for the stage kit to work.

[HMXEnosity]

I had one question about that - is the animation going to remain good if it's auto-generated? Meaning, are there going to be any situations where the singer jumps into the crowd and appears on stage instantly after, like in Here It Goes Again (I think? It may have been a different RB1 song)?

The animation will be in sync if you don't bother with it but cool stuff like stage dives need to be authored in.

I thought I read somewhere that the stage kit gets its info from the rumble data. So I would assume you would need to chart information into an additional track for the stage kit to work.

Nope. The stage kits mainly looks at the authored lighting information from the song.

[JPSChampagne]

I can answer a few of these questions:

1 - yes

2 - don't worry about this. peer review will catch any animation issues. actually the animation part of charting is really really simple and easy to use.

3 - yes

4 - RBN dlc has a different icon / category. RBN dlc and regular dlc are separate entities.

also for the curious, authoring cameras / lighting is completely optional. If you don't author the camera and lighting it will be auto-generated for you. I personally love doing the camera and lighting chart. gives the songs that personal touch.

Hey, thanks so much for the reply. Just curious... Are the animations all preset or can we make our own? The guitarists often mimic the actual notes being played - how will that work? It looks like it would be pretty difficult.

Also, very cool that RBN DLC will have its own icon, but... Say that Sub Pop puts up all the Shins stuff from the same album "New Slang" came from. Will that show up as a full album, or "New Slang" on its own and the rest of the album separately?

And I'm sure this has been answered somewhere and I just haven't seen it, but will the RBN store be included in Rock Band 1 somehow? Or will you have to own Rock Band 2 to access it?

I assume as a default that all of the RBN songs will work with Rock Band 1.

Thanks again everybody, for all the answers. I may just join up with the creator community to make sure someone's there just to review lighting tracks. I hope some people really go all-out with that and do some cool stuff.

[trg007]

And I'm sure this has been answered somewhere and I just haven't seen it, but will the RBN store be included in Rock Band 1 somehow? Or will you have to own Rock Band 2 to access it?

I assume as a default that all of the RBN songs will work with Rock Band 1.

It's RB2 only. RBN songs won't play in RB1 and there won't be a store for it. It was mentioned by a dev the other day. :)

[JPSChampagne]

Oh, well, that's kind of a bummer, but I guess you have to make the move up to the new software eventually anyway. I just have a couple friends who still prefer the first game over the second.

[HMXEnosity]

1 - Are the animations all preset or can we make our own? The guitarists often mimic the actual notes being played - how will that work? It looks like it would be pretty difficult.

2 - Also, very cool that RBN DLC will have its own icon, but... Say that Sub Pop puts up all the Shins stuff from the same album "New Slang" came from. Will that show up as a full album, or "New Slang" on its own and the rest of the album separately?

3 - And I'm sure this has been answered somewhere and I just haven't seen it, but will the RBN store be included in Rock Band 1 somehow? Or will you have to own Rock Band 2 to access it?

4 - I assume as a default that all of the RBN songs will work with Rock Band 1.

1 - More information on Animations is coming soon.

2 - RBN songs will be sortable by album.

3 - No RBN store in RB1.

4 - RBN songs do not work in RB1.

[JPSChampagne]

Sad about RB1. Any technical aspect that kept that from happening? Not that I really expect an answer on that, I'm just curious.

Also, really good line of thought on making RBN DLC its own thing. It's already awkward to scroll through a huge DLC list looking for the half-dozen that somebody else online has. It would be terrible to scroll through hundreds more when RBN goes online. After a bit of thought, that's a genius move on HMX's part.

And good to hear it'll still sort by album and all that. The whole thing seems more and more seamless. I'm more excited the more I learn.

I'm eager to hear details about animations, as well. I think the characters in Rock Band are an underutilized part of the game and being able to get my hands on that one day is a pretty tantalizing concept.

[HMXEnosity]

yeah, can't say why.

[rocker820]

I have two major questions also:

1. Let's say that two different people can get the rights to one song and chart it. Does that mean we will can have two different charts for the exact same song.

2. Let's say you only know how to chart a guitar/ bass chart, will all songs have to include charts for all four instruments if applicable (instrumentals won't have vocals) or can you release a song that can only be played on guitar or something

[HMXEnosity]

1. Let's say that two different people can get the rights to one song and chart it. Does that mean we will can have two different charts for the exact same song.
2. Let's say you only know how to chart a guitar/ bass chart, will all songs have to include charts for all four instruments if applicable (instrumentals won't have vocals) or can you release a song that can only be played on guitar or something

1 - No.

2 - If your song has Vocals, you author vocals.

[Headcase]

4 - RBN songs do work work in RB1.

I make mistakes like this often so I must ask:

Do work or do not work? :)

[HMXEnosity]

I make mistakes like this often so I must ask:

Do work or do not work? :)


DO NOT WORK. thanks for the catch :)
edited my previous post.

[sandswipe]

PUBLIC DOMAIN SONGS: Think House of the Rising Sun or Gallows Pole. Are these going to be allowed, or ONLY original compositions? I've already seen one band talking about putting House of the Rising Sun in there.

[voodoo618]

PUBLIC DOMAIN SONGS: Think House of the Rising Sun or Gallows Pole. Are these going to be allowed, or ONLY original compositions? I've already seen one band talking about putting House of the Rising Sun in there.

HMX has said no to public domain songs, I believe.

EDIT: What the hell just happened?

How did I open this thread from the 1st page of the RBN forum?

Ugh, sorry for the necro-post.

[DavyinaToga]

I'm not complaining. I learned a few things, so I'm happy.

Actually, I have a question: we know where/how to place the MIDI notes for the different difficulties, but what about lights, cameras, and animations? Are those all separate tracks, or will the char animations be made within the lower, unused slots for each instrument's MIDI chart?

[voodoo618]

I'm not complaining. I learned a few things, so I'm happy.

Actually, I have a question: we know where/how to place the MIDI notes for the different difficulties, but what about lights, cameras, and animations? Are those all separate tracks, or will the char animations be made within the lower, unused slots for each instrument's MIDI chart?

Reaper will take care of camera/lights. I'm not sure how animations will work.

[davidshek]

Actually, I have a question: we know where/how to place the MIDI notes for the different difficulties, but what about lights, cameras, and animations? Are those all separate tracks, or will the char animations be made within the lower, unused slots for each instrument's MIDI chart?

The documentation will answer all of these questions. All of the animation and stage cues (lights, camera...ACTION!) are controlled by MIDI.

Reaper will take care of camera/lights. I'm not sure how animations will work.

Correction, it CAN take care of those things if you don't do it yourself. But you have the option of doing it manually too.

[socrstopr]

Correction, it CAN take care of those things if you don't do it yourself. But you have the option of doing it manually too.

Correction MAGMA can do that, not Reaper :p

[davidshek]

Correction MAGMA can do that, not Reaper :p

I don't recall the word "Reaper" appearing anywhere in my post, except in what I quoted, and that wasn't me talking ;)

[voodoo618]

I don't recall the word "Reaper" appearing anywhere in my post, except in what I quoted, and that wasn't me talking ;)

Woah woah woah...

I read that Reaper will let you spot light placement/camera movements. :o

[davidshek]

Woah woah woah...

I read that Reaper will let you spot light placement/camera movements. :o

It will. You can program them yourself in Reaper. But if you don't, Magma will do it for you automatically later in the process.

[voodoo618]

It will. You can program them yourself in Reaper. But if you don't, Magma will do it for you automatically later in the process.

I see.

[Sound_IMP]

And just to cover all bases, If I remember right from a post or one of the videos, you can let Magma process the animations and then import it back to reaper and tweak what it did. All in all the whole thing seems pretty well thought out.

[DavyinaToga]

The documentation will answer all of these questions.


The documentation will answer all of these questions.


The documentation


Those two words make me feel so left out... :(



EDIT: One more question: does an XNA account link to a console, or a Gamertag? Their FAQ doesn't seem to mention which. I have the opportunity to rent a 360/RB2, which is better for me ATM than blowing a load another setup and ditching everything I've already accumlated for the Wii, and I want to make sure I can keep my XNA data with me, whatever I end up using.

[davidshek]

EDIT: One more question: does an XNA account link to a console, or a Gamertag? Their FAQ doesn't seem to mention which. I have the opportunity to rent a 360/RB2, which is better for me ATM than blowing a load another setup and ditching everything I've already accumlated for the Wii, and I want to make sure I can keep my XNA data with me, whatever I end up using.

XNA accounts are linked to an Xbox Live gamertag, not a console.

[DavyinaToga]

DavidShek: The human FAQ FAQ. Thanks

[lowfatevan]

Hey....I've got a question. I know reaper is the suggested DAW for making the midi tracks / audio stems for RBN, and they have to be compiled in Magma to get on the xbox. But can you use another DAW (pro tools / logic) and make the midi / audio in there? Or does magma interface with the reaper files?

just asking because i own pro tools already and am comfortable editing in it, and don't want to have to learn / buy reaper if i don't need to.

Thanks!

[HMXEnosity]

Yes, you can use any DAW. It's just easiest on REAPER.

[lowfatevan]

Yes, you can use any DAW. It's just easiest on REAPER.

Good to know. Thanks. I'll probably use the 30 day trial once i get into the beta (hopefully soon, as i have a band waiting) and see how much easier it is, and if it warrants the 60 dollars for reaper.

[davidshek]

Good to know. Thanks. I'll probably use the 30 day trial once i get into the beta (hopefully soon, as i have a band waiting) and see how much easier it is, and if it warrants the 60 dollars for reaper.

With the Rock Band plugin, Reaper is ridiculously easy. I think you'll dig it. :)

[Alvarado6411]

Reaper is killing me!!

I have yet to figure out how to do the damn tempo mapping!

[davidshek]

Reaper is killing me!!

I have yet to figure out how to do the damn tempo mapping!

Wait till you get the RB plugin and see the docs once they are finalized and posted. It becomes much easier at that point. :)

[Alvarado6411]

Wait till you get the RB plugin and see the docs once they are finalized and posted. It becomes much easier at that point. :)

I have all that (I got it legally) and im in the RBN creators club but I can't for the life of me figure it out.

I'm specifically stuck at Reaper business. Maybe if someone can just give me a good start in helping me out I would appreciate it gratefully.

[LoopyChew]

The "Reaper" documentation page (not any specific authoring page) has a section labeled "Tempo Mapping" which I found easier to use than the one I found in the "Mix and MIDI Setup" page.