So this is basically like the song creator in GH4 but 10x better.

[Riddycal]

All in the title.

[Felldoh_The_Squirrel]

Yes, exactly. ;) It's gonna be so awesome now that we get actually well made stuff, instead of random junk that is unreasonably hard like on GH.

[Sushipunk]

yo, if you want to be black and white about it. yeah sure!

[afterstasis]

really, it's not much like the GH creator... the GH creator was just basically a really bad DAW/sampler with a few "video gamey" features and the ability to share your creations.

RBN is the logical progression of allowing music of all shapes and sizes (whether you made it yourself with a midi controller and garage-band or recorded it in a pro studio with a 9 piece band) an opportunity to be made into a playable track in RB, not to mention allowing artists to make some cash from the downloads.

[Riddycal]

really, it's not much like the GH creator... the GH creator was just basically a really bad DAW/sampler with a few "video gamey" features and the ability to share your creations.

RBN is the logical progression of allowing music of all shapes and sizes (whether you made it yourself with a midi controller and garage-band or recorded it in a pro studio with a 9 piece band) an opportunity to be made into a playable track in RB, not to mention allowing artists to make some cash from the downloads.

i know,that's why i said it's 10x better.

[afterstasis]

i know,that's why i said it's 10x better.

but you also stated that it's like the song creator in GH, but this isn't a song-creator at all... you bring the music on your own, and then use the service to chart and share it.

i get what you're saying, but you'd be surprised how many people still seem to think that they're going to be playing songs that sound like GH's sampled-ringtone crap.

[timmay9]

Comparing the two is dumb. They are nothing alike.

[destruction3402]

It's not 10x better, more like 1000x better.
All you could do in GHWT was some ringtone sounding crap that you could share with others.
In RBN, you can record a song with real instruments and equipment, and then share it, unlike GHWT.

[ArmsAreLoud]

This isn't anything like the Music Studio in World Tour. This is providing the fan base with the same tools that Harmonix has; nothing more, nothing less.

[OakTea]

Except it isn't as widely usable, isn't open for free to anybody who has the game, and is probably temporarily nothing more than occasional extra DLC to PS3 and Wii users.

That being said, it's a really great idea, and I hope it makes its way to other consoles and countries completely.

[Vedicardi]

they are completely different thing.

one makes midi songs, the other allows you to put original REAL songs into a game

[kiggidykev]

The concept is similar in that it allows users that are not developers at HMX to develop song charts and distribute them online. I think the similarities end there, though. The RBN is ridiculously deeper than the GHWT song creator.

[packerfan8675309]

Except it isn't as widely usable, isn't open for free to anybody who has the game, and is probably temporarily nothing more than occasional extra DLC to PS3 and Wii users.

That being said, it's a really great idea, and I hope it makes its way to other consoles and countries completely.

Well if you go the Rhythm Authors direction it is free... They do all the work and the only thing you would pay is to get the track recorded correctly.

[LuigiHann]

Yeah this is really not like the song creator in GH4 at all. Completely different.

[Ferocious Q]

RBN is more like ITUNES in a creative sense. GHWT's music "maker" involves a very small set of prerecorded noises to self-edit. The latter is far from creative.

[Apples]

Conceptually they are both about user-generated content. But the methods of implementation are vastly different.

They are as closely related as lightning is to a lightning bug.

[General Lein979]

It's the answer the same problem, but different solutions. The problem is that people like making custom songs and their is only so much dlc we can release at a time.

GH answer is lets give them the ability to make the songs on disc with prerecorded sounds and mash them together to make a song. Positives: Tech is on disc, anyone can do it, and songs are free. Negatives: Songs sound like ringtones.

Harmonix's is lets give them the ability to put their own songs in the game made with real instruments using the same ramifications and tech they use. Positives: actual songs and can make an indie band gain more fans. Negatives: Cost, buy the tech, musical talent, ability to understand what your doing when you chart, and not anything goes.

So what I'm trying to say the two things are very different and are not comparable.

[primenay13]

Way better, I really don't like gh4 though

[guarf1]

It will be completely different from GH4's music studio. First of all It won't be free. If you go to http://creators.rockband.com/ and look under the Review tab you will see in small print that it says that a membership will be $99/year. Secondly you will have to own the rights to the track, so you can't just download someones song and use it. It will also have to be approved by the community or the song won't be released. It will only be for Xbox Live and only select songs will be available for the PS3.

[Oddbrother]

What do you think makes it 10x better? The fact that we don't make our own music and steal someone else's just to chart 'em?

[Quazifuji]

The best way I've seen to think about it is that the difference between GHTunes and RBN is like the difference between playing Rock Band and playing a real instrument. One's a accessible and fun diversion but you generally can't get too much out of it besides entertainment, while the other requires a lot of skill, time, and money to use but is a much bigger deal and you can potentially profit from it.

In short, Rock Band Network doesn't obsolete the GH music creator for the same reason that real instruments don't obsolete rhythm games.


It's the answer the same problem, but different solutions. The problem is that people like making custom songs and their is only so much dlc we can release at a time.


Actually, I think these are two completely different problems,that people like making custom songs, and that Harmonix/Neversoft can only make so much DLC.

The GH music creator mainly solves the first problem. It lets anyone make and play their own little songs without much musical knowledge or skill. The ability for other people to download them helps a bit for the second problem, but the low quality of the songs produced means most of the appeal generally relies on the ability to create your own, not to download other people's songs.

RBN exists primarilly to solve the limited DLC problem. By allowing bands to do the work themselves (or hiring someone else to do it), there will be more songs available as DLC than Harmonix could possibly chart themselves, including from bands that Harmonix has probably never even heard of. It may also satisfy the hardcore custom charters a bit, but the high barrier of entry for creating songs (money, lots of time, relatively steep learning curve, needs to be professional quality, and you need to actually have the rights to a real song) means that it's primary purpose is to increase the amount of DLC available and the ease with which bands can get into Rock Band.


What do you think makes it 10x better? The fact that we don't make our own music and steal someone else's just to chart 'em?

You can't really steal someone else's music to chart it in RBN. I mean, you might technically be able to, but even aside from the legality issues, you'd only be able to to play it in audition mode, wouldn't be able to submit it,

[Darth Fizz]

Yea this isn't even close to comparing to GH music creator. If RB wanted to make a music creator then they would call it Rock Band Music Creator. =P Plus it sounds much cooler. I know a couple of friends in local bands around where i live that would like to have their music put on here. :D

[Lunar_Savage]

The best way I've seen to think about it is that the difference between GHTunes and RBN is like the difference between playing Rock Band and playing a real instrument. One's a accessible and fun diversion but you generally can't get too much out of it besides entertainment, while the other requires a lot of skill, time, and money to use but is a much bigger deal and you can potentially profit from it.

In short, Rock Band Network doesn't obsolete the GH music creator for the same reason that real instruments don't obsolete rhythm games.



Actually, I think these are two completely different problems,that people like making custom songs, and that Harmonix/Neversoft can only make so much DLC.

The GH music creator mainly solves the first problem. It lets anyone make and play their own little songs without much musical knowledge or skill. The ability for other people to download them helps a bit for the second problem, but the low quality of the songs produced means most of the appeal generally relies on the ability to create your own, not to download other people's songs.

RBN exists primarilly to solve the limited DLC problem. By allowing bands to do the work themselves (or hiring someone else to do it), there will be more songs available as DLC than Harmonix could possibly chart themselves, including from bands that Harmonix has probably never even heard of. It may also satisfy the hardcore custom charters a bit, but the high barrier of entry for creating songs (money, lots of time, relatively steep learning curve, needs to be professional quality, and you need to actually have the rights to a real song) means that it's primary purpose is to increase the amount of DLC available and the ease with which bands can get into Rock Band.



You can't really steal someone else's music to chart it in RBN. I mean, you might technically be able to, but even aside from the legality issues, you'd only be able to to play it in audition mode, wouldn't be able to submit it,

LMAO, I can't help but put what you just said this way:

Neversoft made a poor man's music creator while Harmonix made a rich man's music creator.

That high barrier you mentioned about RBN is a real turn off...mainly the cash part...but then again, I'm unemployed at the moment so...maybe thats why I say this. I'd gladly take the time to learn how to use everything, but I really don't wanna have to put up all that cash to release a song on RBN that might not do well. Then again, I'm a pessimist, so what do I know? :/

However, the fact it allows real songs is a great upside. :)

[afterstasis]

I'd gladly take the time to learn how to use everything, but I really don't wanna have to put up all that cash to release a song on RBN that might not do well.

you don't have to do either, though...
there are quite a few groups taking submissions who will do the RBN work for musicians who want to have their music released, basically eliminating the membership fee and charting process in exchange for a percentage of the profits.

[Lunar_Savage]

you don't have to do either, though...
there are quite a few groups taking submissions who will do the RBN work for musicians who want to have their music released, basically eliminating the membership fee and charting process in exchange for a percentage of the profits.

Cool. Then I guess its not so bad then.

[eddiehead-666]

Me and a friend were talking about this about 2 days before it was announced - saying "wouldn't it be great if Harmonix could just release the software they use to chart the songs to us - that way we could get our own songs and chart it"

The main reason for this though appears to not be what I originally wanted. I'd like harmonix to release the software to anyone (maybe a fee through XBL/PSN) so that we can put any song we want on there.

There are so many songs I want to jam along to on rock band that I imagine won't get released - I'm sure lots of people are the same, and of course the next person along won't necessarily want what I want. But I can still import Iron Maiden's The Wicker Man and have the software chart it for me and do a few tweaks here and there then i can jam along to the song on my console.

Of course, if bands want to release songs and make money from DCL etc they can still pay the subscription allowing them to upload - but I'm not bothered about that. I want this music creator so that I can put my favourite songs onto my console for my own enjoyment.

Reckon Harmonix might consider doing that?

[LuigiHann]

There are so many songs I want to jam along to on rock band that I imagine won't get released - I'm sure lots of people are the same, and of course the next person along won't necessarily want what I want. But I can still import Iron Maiden's The Wicker Man and have the software chart it for me and do a few tweaks here and there then i can jam along to the song on my console.

It doesn't work that way, at all. The best they could possibly do with auto-charting along with an mp3 would end up synchronizing with the music about as well as audiosurf (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EsVyEnhxWY) does. It's conceivable that someday they'd have software that could chart based on the pitch of the sounds, but even that would require a split master track to isolate the individual instruments (not for the usual reasons, but because the software would need to "hear" them separately to auto-chart them).

So even if they did release the tools to everybody for free, you'd still have to spend hours and hours charting the song manually.

[eddiehead-666]

It doesn't work that way, at all. The best they could possibly do with auto-charting along with an mp3 would end up synchronizing with the music about as well as audiosurf (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EsVyEnhxWY) does. It's conceivable that someday they'd have software that could chart based on the pitch of the sounds, but even that would require a split master track to isolate the individual instruments (not for the usual reasons, but because the software would need to "hear" them separately to auto-chart them).

So even if they did release the tools to everybody for free, you'd still have to spend hours and hours charting the song manually.

and I deffo should have included that I only use the drums - so the pitch wouldn't make a difference to me.
I'm pretty sure Harmonix has the ability to split tracks down to seperate sounds. I've been using similar software in music enginnering for a while now, the software is out there and most of it does run automatically
I read somewhere also that the software harmonix is planning to release does have some automatic features, such as speed adjustments, notes per beat calculations and will fill in some of the more basic structures for all instruments. Even if it matches the amount of notes you need to play all that will then require is for you to go in and move the already charted buttons to a different button (so if it sees 50 green notes one after the other in a solo, you can then go in and move any of the notes around to a different button to make it represent scales and the pitch changing of the song as you said)

BTW there was also a similar piece of software to this released with dance dance revolution on the PC about 3 years ago - it mapped almost all of the notes that it heard in a song, you just went in and played with what it gave you. Fair enough you'll say it's not the same as having a guitar controller "authentically" match pitch changes, but the possibilities are there

oh and also personally most of the fun of creating a track would be to actually chart it out manually. more sense of achievement knowing you're jamming along to something that you - in part - created and it's the music you love. To me that would near enough mean having to learn how to play the song as if I were on a real kit

[afterstasis]

I'm pretty sure Harmonix has the ability to split tracks down to seperate sounds. I've been using similar software in music enginnering for a while now, the software is out there and most of it does run automatically

please share this software with the rest of the world! :)

melodyne's direct note access is still the closest i've heard of this, and it still hasn't been released (possible vaporware at this point, really) and will doubtfully be as automatic many expect.

[Punk_Floyd76]

Me and a friend were talking about this about 2 days before it was announced - saying "wouldn't it be great if Harmonix could just release the software they use to chart the songs to us - that way we could get our own songs and chart it"

The main reason for this though appears to not be what I originally wanted. I'd like harmonix to release the software to anyone (maybe a fee through XBL/PSN) so that we can put any song we want on there.

There are so many songs I want to jam along to on rock band that I imagine won't get released - I'm sure lots of people are the same, and of course the next person along won't necessarily want what I want. But I can still import Iron Maiden's The Wicker Man and have the software chart it for me and do a few tweaks here and there then i can jam along to the song on my console.

Of course, if bands want to release songs and make money from DCL etc they can still pay the subscription allowing them to upload - but I'm not bothered about that. I want this music creator so that I can put my favourite songs onto my console for my own enjoyment.

Reckon Harmonix might consider doing that?

Do I reckon harmonix would consider eliminating any and all future DLC and possibly disc revenue(plus legal fees from the countless lawsuits they'd receive) so you can play your favorite songs? No I don't reckon.

[riseagainstfoofighters]

Not really. This you have to write the songs yourself on real instruments and pay money and earn money from your songs. The Gh4(which was terrible) and the Gh5(which is way better than the gh4 one) music creators let you use the guitar hero instruments and it was free. I will probably never use the RBN for my songs but I have already used the gh5 one.

[iruhlman]

just curious, how is GH5 any better with its studio software? Still sounds like midi to me.

[toymachineSH]

samples are higher quality
song length is 10 minutes
rhythm and lead can be combined

[zero_raver]

It's like Mario Paint being compared to Garage Band

[Icarus599]

No, GH has an independant song creator, where you can make original songs and share them for free.

This is a program where no name bands can chart their song and put it for download in the game. Problem being is none of these bands are actually going to be good.

They're completely different things.

[Icarus599]

just curious, how is GH5 any better with its studio software? Still sounds like midi to me.

Answer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsXSmzdf6PQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLGEhFpU21U&feature=related

Sounds a lot better than midi to me, well except the last note of the first one XD

[davidshek]

Problem being is none of these bands are actually going to be good.

Way to be closed-minded there, buddy. I'd recommend actually listening to some of the prospective bands already before making a sweeping generalization like that.

Here ya go, expand your horizons:
http://www.rockband.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157235

And remember, your favorite band of all time was once a "no name" band you'd never heard of before.

[afterstasis]

Problem being is none of these bands are actually going to be good.


i was curious as to whether i should waste my time responding to this ignorant comment, and lo and behold your next post answered it for me...


Answer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsXSmzdf6PQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLGEhFpU21U&feature=related

Sounds a lot better than midi to me, well except the last note of the first one XD

hahahahaha!

[instantdeath999]

No, GH has an independant song creator, where you can make original songs and share them for free.

This is a program where no name bands can chart their song and put it for download in the game. Problem being is none of these bands are actually going to be good.

They're completely different things.

You're adorable. Would you like some candy?