"Kick drum disabled" cheat [Archive] - Rock Band Forums // Rock Band®

SSPWOLF

12-21-2007, 06:38 AM

I think this is a good idea

Either that or find a way to give us 2 pedals at once

Seriously... what douchebag runs around with 1 bass pedal anymore? Nobody should force 1 leg to do so much work and get so much excersize while the other leg sits there not buffing up

1 muscular leg and 1 regular = WTF? Thats what would happen if you played single bass drums all the time

Its just plain uncomfortable and really weird for your legs muscle growth to use single bass

When people learn to play the real drums they almost never use a double kick pedal, and the Hi-Hat pedal usually doesn't come into play for most novice drummers until they've got weeks - months of practice. Most people aren't coordinated enough to use four limbs at once (or even three, as this thread would state)

I'm no physical trainer but I think the odds of you getting "1 muscular leg and 1 regular" from playing rockband are slim... unless Rock Band is the only exercise you get, in which case you've got bigger problems than anything on this forum can help you solve.

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 09:01 AM

When people learn to play the real drums they almost never use a double kick pedal, and the Hi-Hat pedal usually doesn't come into play for most novice drummers until they've got weeks - months of practice. Most people aren't coordinated enough to use four limbs at once (or even three, as this thread would state)

I hate this pathetic excuse that most people aren't coordinated to use 3 limbs. Just because you can't do something doesn't mean that others are as inept. most people CAN use 3 limbs after just a few minutes of practice.

Bluvox

12-21-2007, 09:06 AM

I hate this pathetic excuse that most people aren't coordinated to use 3 limbs. Just because you can't do something doesn't mean that others are as inept. most people CAN use 3 limbs after just a few minutes of practice.

Out the door, many folks will have problems with trying to get 3 limbs coordinated in a complex beat. But with PRACTICE (a word you already used) many of those will be able to work through it. Some have natural talent and a sense of rhythm, some can be taught easily, and some have difficulties. It just depends on how much someone is willing to struggle through to get to the end.

I think if having the cheat on required you to only play in "easy" mode, it would be an awesome idea. Great for folks just learning and wanting to get a beat going, especially for kids.

ixFatalDeathxi

12-21-2007, 09:10 AM

What's the point of playing drums if there's no bass pedal.:D

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 09:20 AM

Out the door, many folks will have problems with trying to get 3 limbs coordinated in a complex beat. But with PRACTICE (a word you already used) many of those will be able to work through it. Some have natural talent and a sense of rhythm, some can be taught easily, and some have difficulties. It just depends on how much someone is willing to struggle through to get to the end.

I think if having the cheat on required you to only play in "easy" mode, it would be an awesome idea. Great for folks just learning and wanting to get a beat going, especially for kids.

Playing the game counts as practice. Out the door, I've yet to experience any players that can't use the bass pedal after 1 or 2 songs. Most of them can get through a song their first time through.

Bluvox

12-21-2007, 09:24 AM

Playing the game counts as practice. Out the door, I've yet to experience any players that can't use the bass pedal after 1 or 2 songs. Most of them can get through a song their first time through.

And? You're experience is with millions of people, or just a few? Most of the folks that have been willing to give the drums a go that I know of have done... "okay", I struggle with the pedal some, but not terribly unless I'm playing on medium..

Just because your limited experience says it's not an issue doesn't mean others think it otherwise.

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 09:31 AM

And? You're experience is with millions of people, or just a few? Most of the folks that have been willing to give the drums a go that I know of have done... "okay", I struggle with the pedal some, but not terribly unless I'm playing on medium..

Just because your limited experience says it's not an issue doesn't mean others think it otherwise.

Fine, go ask any grade school music teacher or anybody that teaches drum lessons. There's a local volunteer group that teaches area kids to play drums. All of the kids easily learn the standard rock beat in a couple (less than 5) minutes.

I don't care about putting a cheat in a game but if you are failing on easy because of the kick pedal, you might have real problems.

Bluvox

12-21-2007, 09:42 AM

Fine, go ask any grade school music teacher or anybody that teaches drum lessons. There's a local volunteer group that teaches area kids to play drums. All of the kids easily learn the standard rock beat in a couple (less than 5) minutes.

I don't care about putting a cheat in a game but if you are failing on easy because of the kick pedal, you might have real problems.

And they are playing it at full "rock" speed? Doubtful, probably playing at 40% to 60% speed the first few WEEKS, and playing a really basic repeating beat. If this was "drum lessons" and not "rock band", it would make sense to follow drum lessons to a T. I'm sure almost anyone could get a basic rock beat in a day, but even on easy the sequences on rock band aren't just the simple beats.

Personally, I'm okay without the cheat. Just not using it for easy and medium will not make you fail out. You won't 5 star any songs, but you can literally ignore the kick and not fail songs.. got to a point in "Green Grass and High Tides" where I had to do that in order to keep going for a while.. and worked okay.

Edgehopper

12-21-2007, 09:45 AM

Wanny1

12-21-2007, 09:49 AM

Sorry but what "3 limbs" means, I'm french and really don't know what you guys mean.

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 09:53 AM

And they are playing it at full "rock" speed? Doubtful, probably playing at 40% to 60% speed the first few WEEKS, and playing a really basic repeating beat. If this was "drum lessons" and not "rock band", it would make sense to follow drum lessons to a T. I'm sure almost anyone could get a basic rock beat in a day, but even on easy the sequences on rock band aren't just the simple beats.

Personally, I'm okay without the cheat. Just not using it for easy and medium will not make you fail out. You won't 5 star any songs, but you can literally ignore the kick and not fail songs.. got to a point in "Green Grass and High Tides" where I had to do that in order to keep going for a while.. and worked okay.

They play it at 100% speed. I know that it's hard for you to wrap your mind around the fact that you sucking at drums is the exception and not the rule. Nobody spends weeks playing at 60% speed. When I said they learn the beat in a few minutes, that's what I meant. That's how easy it is for most people.

Yea, anybody can get the basic rock beat in a day. Anybody can get the basic rock beat in under 10 minutes. It's not hard at all. Unless you are physically or mentally handicapped or under the age of 5, there's no reason it should take you longer than 10 minutes to learn a standard beat at full speed.

Sorry but what "3 limbs" means, I'm french and really don't know what you guys mean.

Both arms and a leg.

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 09:57 AM

I honestly have no idea what you guys are debating about; it really isn't tough to use the bass pedal, especially on Medium or Easy. I started out on Medium on release day and now I play on Expert (haven't beaten drum career yet, though; stuck on Don't Fear the Reaper and Foreplay/Longtime). If you honestly can't follow the basic beat of the songs (no, there's no set "rock beat", but the beat varies from song to song and it's not hard to pick up), keep practicing or go ahead and give up drums, because that's what they're all about: keeping the beat.

Bluvox

12-21-2007, 10:00 AM

They play it at 100% speed. I know that it's hard for you to wrap your mind around the fact that you sucking at drums is the exception and not the rule. Nobody spends weeks playing at 60% speed. When I said they learn the beat in a few minutes, that's what I meant. That's how easy it is for most people.

Nice way to resort to a physical attack on me. Did I say I didn't suck, or that I couldn't use the pedal? I said I had problems on "green grass and high tides", which is a challenging piece. But.. great way to show your ability to debate on a forum.

Yea, anybody can get the basic rock beat in a day. Anybody can get the basic rock beat in under 10 minutes. It's not hard at all. Unless you are physically or mentally handicapped or under the age of 5, there's no reason it should take you longer than 10 minutes to learn a standard beat at full speed.

Where did I say you can't learn a "standard" or "basic" beat quickly? I said, to be accurate -

but even on easy the sequences on rock band aren't just the simple beats.

Red on all 4, yellow on 1 and 3, pedal and 2 and 4... yeah, pretty simple stuff. Your inability to handle yourself as an adult on a message board ... priceless.

sa_nick

12-21-2007, 10:49 AM

For the sake of young kids or people who are, for whatever reason, unable to use their leg it would be a good idea. If your just looking to make it easier though then that sucks. Hitting that bass pedal is probably the most challenging, and thus most rewarding things about the game, not to mention the kickass sound it makes when u stomp down on it.

davidshek

12-21-2007, 10:52 AM

<del>Red</del> Yellow on all 4, <del>yellow</del> pedal on 1 and 3, <del>pedal</del> red and 2 and 4... yeah, pretty simple stuff.

There, fixed that for ya...

NOW it's a basic 4/4 beat. Yours was kinda jacked up. :)

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 10:53 AM

There, fixed that for ya...

NOW it's a basic 4/4 beat. Yours was kinda jacked up. :)

Not unless he was playing Enter Sandman on Expert with Lefty Flip turned on.

WorldWarJack

12-21-2007, 11:21 AM

you know what really irks me? the small majority of people capable of doing well on Expert with drums thinking EVERYONE should be capable of doing Expert on drums just because they can do it. That is some of the most inane logic I have ever heard. And I'm gonna have to disagree with the "off the top of the head" theory that ANYONE can master basic beats on drums in under 10 minutes. Of course the reality is even if that were so, the drums in Rock Band arn't exactly on scale with those of a real drum set.

My experience with the drums so far hasn't been the best. I'm managing through most of the songs on easy, but some of them are tearing me a new one. I fail not too long into the song. Also I havn't been able to find a comfy enough position to be in to where it doesn't feel like my leg is on fire after using the pedal only partway through a song. I like the drums, but considering how difficult they are for me simply on easy is a putoff for me. Most of my time is spent the guitar which is proving to be a bit too easy to start off with. Easy and Medium to me on the guitar is nothing too difficult at all. Does this mean ANYONE should be able to have a real easy time on guitar? No. Does it mean they suck because they're not as good on it? No. Does it mean they're mentally handicapped in some way? No. Does it mean I should be a total jerk about it and rag on them becuase they can't do something as easily as I can? No.

All in all I think they should implement the ability to do it without using the kick pedal. Personally I like to play for fun and the kick pedal is taking away a good bit of that fun for me right now because I havn't gotten good at using it yet. I don't think that using a cheat to not have to use the kick pedal should disable saving, but I do think it would be unfair to allow you to gain achievements with the cheat enabled.

:cool:

And for everyone who seems to have mastered an instrument in the game and is having trouble understanding why other people are having such a hard time with something so "simple" why don't you remember all the times you had difficulty with something that everyone else was figuring out pretty quickly. Shouldn't be that hard. Everyone has difficulty with things in their life that others pick up pretty easily. Ever failed a test in school? Were you handicapped for failing the test?

the_maddingtons

12-21-2007, 11:26 AM

I love flame wars. :-)

WorldWarJack

12-21-2007, 11:41 AM

I love flame wars. :-)

Ironic they're called that because if this were in person I'd prolly be prone use a flamethrower ;) . Lot easier to dispose of a skeleton then a full human body. ....umm...not that I would know anything about that *whistles*

TheTogfather

12-21-2007, 11:45 AM

as long as it disabled all leaderboard/saving things, then this would be great. Would open the door for not only small kids and rhythmically challenged folk, but also for some physically challenged people who would like to wail on the drums.

HMXDave

12-21-2007, 11:58 AM

Let's be realistic. Some people just have zero rhythm or coordination.

My friend Steph came over last week and tried the drums on easy. As soon as the kick pedal was introduced, she failed. So she might benefit from a cheat like this.

But then my friend Kevin came over and he five-starred a song on expert. He said it was because he had played that song on a real drum kit before.

Now I know what you're thinking. Kevin obviously is better because he plays drums. Wrong. He played drums at one point, and sucked at it. However, he is good at video games.

Remember, as realistic as the drumming seems, its still just a video game.

For example, my friend Larry has been playing the drums for over 20 years. He is quite good at it. But he hates video games. I had him sit down at the drums on Rock Band and he picked Rockaway Beach on Expert. He quickly failed. He was trying to play the drums the way the are actually played. He kept hitting extra notes that weren't on the chart and doing really complicated things. In his defense, that is how you actually play the song, but he couldn't force himself to "dumb it down" to match the chart. So playing the drums actually made it harder for him.

Personally, the drums do not come naturally to me. I play bass IRL. Easy was the most I could handle at first. Now I'm playing a career on Medium and can even beat a few songs on Hard. I know the only reason for this is because I keep practicing. The kick pedal is by far the hardest part to learn. But with practice it comes to you.

I bet that with a kick drum disabled cheat, I would be able to rock Expert with no problem. But you also have to remember, if you never use the kick drum, you'll never learn how to use it. So using that cheat would only hurt you in the long run.

Of course the kick pedal is hard. That's why they made it orange.

dfjdejulio

12-21-2007, 12:01 PM

Fine, as long as there's no saving, unlocking, achieving, or anything else of consequence active while the cheat's on. It is a good idea for the disabled and little kids who don't have a natural sense of rhythm, the latter being particularly useful for Rock Band as a family game.

I'd also probably use that cheat at work here, where I think we'll have room to set the drum pads up on a lunch table, but I don't think I'd want to fuss with getting the pedal set up. Yeah, if such a cheat were around, but it disabled saves and leaderboards and all that stuff, I'd probably use it once in a while.

(At least, I would early next year, once I can buy the drum kit...)

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 12:07 PM

Nice way to resort to a physical attack on me. Did I say I didn't suck, or that I couldn't use the pedal? I said I had problems on "green grass and high tides", which is a challenging piece. But.. great way to show your ability to debate on a forum.

Where did I say you can't learn a "standard" or "basic" beat quickly? I said, to be accurate -

Red on all 4, yellow on 1 and 3, pedal and 2 and 4... yeah, pretty simple stuff. Your inability to handle yourself as an adult on a message board ... priceless.

I physically attacked you? I should get some kind of reward for finding out how to punch people through a computer. Here's a dictionary to help you out. (http://m-w.com/dictionary/physical)

Also, when you learn (http://m-w.com/dictionary/learn) a beat, you are accurate.

I'm calling bull on your "Red on all 4, yellow on 1 and 3, pedal and 2 and 4". What song on easy (or any mode for that matter) has that?

To the person that said that because we play on expert, everybody else should be able to as well, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that Easy mode is actually easy and if you play through the songs, the learning curve isn't very hard. This is a game and you're expected to get better. It's not a circle jerk. I started out on medium and some songs kicked my ass. I couldn't beat a couple of hard songs for days. I have played through half of expert now. Do I expect the songs to get easier because it's harder for me? No, just like everything else in life, I have to get better..and I am.

If you're buddies hop on as soon as they come over, make them play on easy mode with the easy songs. Start off with Say it Ain't So and work them into harder ones.

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 12:07 PM

batsu336

12-21-2007, 12:41 PM

I think that disabling the pedal destroys the whole point of using the drums. Might as well have a guitar cheat where you don't have to push the buttons, or a vocal cheat where you don't have to sing in key. Let's make a war game where it's only optional that you get hurt when you are shot while we are at it. What's the point in playing if it is so easy that you have nothing to strive for?

By the way...I STINK at drums. I can handle easy..usually...sometimes. And yes, I am still against disabling the pedal. It is fine as is. If you try for more than 30 minutes and still can't get through a song, I think God is telling you to stick to guitar and vocals.

WorldWarJack

12-21-2007, 12:50 PM

World War Jack, can you count?

I would hope so.

If you can count, then you can play these drums. It's all counting and timing. It's not hard at all. Yellow on 1, 2, 3, and 4 with a red on 2 and a bass on 4.

Anyone who can count to a beat and move both of their arms and at least one of their legs can play this game. It's really not that hard on the lower difficulties.

Hey Chris, can you draw lines that go strait as well as curve? Or draw simple shapes like a circle or triangle? I hope so. If you can do that then you should be able to sketch out a beautiful piece of art. Maybe get a job as a comic book artist or cartoonist. Pretty much that's all it is, lines and shapes. It's really not that hard to draw a Simpsons character and yet so many people who try end up with horrible disproportionate drawings or with semi-erased lines everywhere all over the drawing.

Unless you're a savant, pretty much everything takes a lot of practice. If everything truly was as easy as all successful people say they are, we'd all be millionaires by now, because we'd know exactly what to do and how to simply go about doing it. But that's not the case. What's easy and what isn't easy is opinion. Drums might be easy to you and others, but they're not to everyone. To me, the guitar is easy, but the drums aren't.

WorldWarJack

12-21-2007, 12:58 PM

By the way...I STINK at drums. I can handle easy..usually...sometimes. And yes, I am still against disabling the pedal. It is fine as is. If you try for more than 30 minutes and still can't get through a song, I think God is telling you to stick to guitar and vocals.

Just think of how dull and uneventful life would be if we simply gave up on everything we weren't able to complete the first time around. That's a pretty sad God if he's telling us to give up on things just because they're difficult.

espher

12-21-2007, 12:59 PM

I don't necessarily have a problem with a cheat like this being implemented, but I still think it's a bad idea.

FaMiCuS

12-21-2007, 01:02 PM

If you can count, then you can play these drums. It's all counting and timing. It's not hard at all. Yellow on 1, 2, 3, and 4 with a red on 2 and a bass on 4.

Anyone who can count to a beat and move both of their arms and at least one of their legs can play this game. It's really not that hard on the lower difficulties.

Unfortunately not all drummers play standard 4/4 beats with just quarter notes. And when you play the lower levels it's get really boring just hitting the bass drum on 2 and the snare on 4 for a whole chorus.

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 01:09 PM

You're taking what I said out of proportion. Moving you hands and your foot to a simple beat and drawing a scene from the Simpsons are two different things, even in comparing then as analogies. Drawing takes skill and sometimes natural talent. Drumming a simple 1-2-3-4 beat just takes the ability to count and move your limbs.

Now, if you had said that drawing simple lines and shapes is like playing on Easy, while drawing comics is like playing on Expert, it would have made more sense. Counting, timing, and moving your limbs are the base for drumming, just like simple lines and curves are the building blocks for drawings. If you can do the beat I mentioned earlier, I'm not saying that you can go ahead and jump up to Expert, I'm saying that it's possible for you to get there. If you can't count a simple beat and move your limbs in timing, there's no hope for you playing on Expert without tons of practice.

And Famicus, I was just using that beat as an example. I know the songs don't play with just quarter notes (except maybe 29 Fingers), but you can still count to 4. Even if it's 16th notes, I still count to 4 to look at the beat in a rather simple way.

AgainstOne

12-21-2007, 01:11 PM

i really hope they put in a cheat for disabling the drum pedal. my kids would love to be able to play the drums with me without causing me to fail a song.

FaMiCuS

12-21-2007, 01:36 PM

And Famicus, I was just using that beat as an example. I know the songs don't play with just quarter notes (except maybe 29 Fingers), but you can still count to 4. Even if it's 16th notes, I still count to 4 to look at the beat in a rather simple way.
I would like you to you explain to someone 16th notes while only counting 1 2 3 4 who just got this game and knows nothing about beats, and especially how break your leg for usually tapping the beat in quarter or half notes like most people do when they listen to music. I'm not trying to start and flame war, I just trying to state not every one is going to be able to get to the skill they need to be to make the game the enjoyable on drums, and the bass drum is usually the cause of this. It's not going to kill you if someone uses and "bass drum disable cheat" to help people enjoy the game, since that is what the game is made for, for people to enjoy it, not to get pissed off and throw the sticks and the screen.

JimJolly

12-21-2007, 01:38 PM

My step daughter is in a wheelchair from a paralyzing accident years ago. She loves Guitar Hero and has Rock Band now but she can't play drums much past the first few songs on Easy 'cause she can't do the bass pedal. She sometimes puts the pedal under one of her arms and squeezes it as she's hittin' the pads. Other times she has her 4-yr old son stomp the pedal as she plays the other four colors. She's not interested in dominating any online leaderboards so a "Disabled Cheat" that would prevent her from posting scores or saving wouldn't be a big loss to her. She could even get a doctor to write a note if that's what it took. I think it would be a good thing to have for those physically challenged rockers. And lord knows, with the war going on, we'll have more and more of them passing time with video games. I vote for a bass-drum disable cheat.

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 01:49 PM

I would like you to you explain to someone 16th notes while only counting 1 2 3 4 who just got this game and knows nothing about beats, and especially how break your leg for usually tapping the beat in quarter or half notes like most people do when they listen to music. I'm not trying to start and flame war, I just trying to state not every one is going to be able to get to the skill they need to be to make the game the enjoyable on drums, and the bass drum is usually the cause of this. It's not going to kill you if someone uses and "bass drum disable cheat" to help people enjoy the game, since that is what the game is made for, for people to enjoy it, not to get pissed off and throw the sticks and the screen.

I guess you're right about the time signature bit. It would be hard doing the 16th note thing. I got around to doing that by slowing it down in practice mode, still counting as a 4/4 beat, and just speeding it up as it got faster. Not sure if that'd work for everyone.

As for the "no bass pedal" bit of your post, now you're putting words in my mouth. Not once have I said that it should not be in the game. I'd honestly be fine with it, provided it didn't allow saving, achievements, leaderboards, or online play with it. It'd be great for younger kids who can't reach the pedal or disabled people. All of my posts in here have been related to whether or not it's too difficult to use the pedal on the lower difficulties.

FaMiCuS

12-21-2007, 02:03 PM

As for the "no bass pedal" bit of your post, now you're putting words in my mouth. Not once have I said that it should not be in the game. I'd honestly be fine with it, provided it didn't allow saving, achievements, leaderboards, or online play with it. It'd be great for younger kids who can't reach the pedal or disabled people. All of my posts in here have been related to whether or not it's too difficult to use the pedal on the lower difficulties.
I apologize if I misread your post and thought you said that, I might of got confused and took someone else's post as your's, sorry for the confusion and misdirected comment. I agree about no achievements, no leaderboards, and no online matches (such as ranked), but I think saving should be aloud so a person would not have to restart a "no bass pedal" career and not be able to have the fun having their own custom character in solo career and band world tour.

Micker

12-21-2007, 02:05 PM

My nephew tries to play the drums and he is only 4. He can't even reach the bass pedal :).

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 02:11 PM

I apologize if I misread your post and thought you said that, I might of got confused and took someone else's post as your's, sorry for the confusion and misdirected comment. I agree about no achievements, no leaderboards, and no online matches (such as ranked), but I think saving should be aloud so a person would not have to restart a "no bass pedal" career and not be able to have the fun having their own custom character in solo career and band world tour.

It's alright.

Well, I don't really think it should be available in career if there is one. Quick Play only makes sense, but you can create a character and not have a career mode.

FaMiCuS

12-21-2007, 02:16 PM

It's alright.

Well, I don't really think it should be available in career if there is one. Quick Play only makes sense, but you can create a character and not have a career mode.But in Quick Play you are not able to use that created player, that's why I suggested the no bass pedal career.

Chris_Gonzalez

12-21-2007, 02:45 PM

In regular quickplay you can't (for some odd reason), but you can in band quick play. But I see what you're saying.

Joatmon

12-21-2007, 03:24 PM

Yes, good idea!

the_spike

12-21-2007, 03:26 PM

How we would even know it's not already in? We've only discovered one cheat since launch.

gliff159

12-21-2007, 04:10 PM

this would be nice for those of us who have had the bass pedal break and the guitar break and now were sitting with a $170 kerokie game

dfjdejulio

12-21-2007, 04:14 PM

I think that disabling the pedal destroys the whole point of using the drums.

Great! Then if such a cheat becomes available, you won't use it.

As long as it disables saves and leaderboards and such (to keep a level playing field whenever records are being kept), the fact that you won't use it isn't a reason not to have it there for the people who would.

Ultrace

12-21-2007, 05:23 PM

Great! Then if such a cheat becomes available, you won't use it.

As long as it disables saves and leaderboards and such (to keep a level playing field whenever records are being kept), the fact that you won't use it isn't a reason not to have it there for the people who would.
Then you must support the no-strum cheat for those of us who can't handle fretting and strumming on the guitar. And also, you support hyperspeed? And a "no-fail" code so that individuals or your whole band can play through without actually needing to worry about the notes or band meter? Perhaps an infinite Overdrive code so that people can continuously have their guitar effects running?

The point of my quite frankly ridiculous exaggerations is that just because someone else can choose not to use something, is not a good reason in itself for an option to be in the game.

dfjdejulio

12-21-2007, 05:37 PM

Then you must support the no-strum cheat for those of us who can't handle fretting and strumming on the guitar. And also, you support hyperspeed? And a "no-fail" code so that individuals or your whole band can play through without actually needing to worry about the notes or band meter? Perhaps an infinite Overdrive code so that people can continuously have their guitar effects running?

I wouldn't oppose any of those, as long as they disabled leaderboards and stuff when activated.

The only one of those I think I'd use myself is the "no-fail" code, for when my little nephew comes over and wants to play -- he doesn't understand why he can't, and it makes him unhappy. (If we give him a guitar that doesn't do anything at all, he figures it out pretty quick.)

But I have no reason to oppose any of that stuff. Do you think the only choices are "support" and "oppose"?

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 06:34 PM

I wouldn't oppose any of those, as long as they disabled leaderboards and stuff when activated.

The only one of those I think I'd use myself is the "no-fail" code, for when my little nephew comes over and wants to play -- he doesn't understand why he can't, and it makes him unhappy. (If we give him a guitar that doesn't do anything at all, he figures it out pretty quick.)

But I have no reason to oppose any of that stuff. Do you think the only choices are "support" and "oppose"?

What do you mean he doesn't understand why he can't play? It's called effective communication. Stop babying him and tell him it's because he's too young. There are plenty of things that he can't do because of his age. what do you tell him if he asks to drive a car, cook, or hold a knife?

Ultrace

12-21-2007, 07:21 PM

What do you mean he doesn't understand why he can't play? It's called effective communication. Stop babying him and tell him it's because he's too young. There are plenty of things that he can't do because of his age. what do you tell him if he asks to drive a car, cook, or hold a knife?
Even as someone who doesn't want to see the no-kick option tossed in, I can see a definite difference between this and the activities you mentioned, all of which could be extremely dangerous. Now, if you said something like "if he asks to vote"...

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 07:25 PM

Even as someone who doesn't want to see the no-kick option tossed in, I can see a definite difference between this and the activities you mentioned, all of which could be extremely dangerous. Now, if you said something like "if he asks to vote"...

The point was that you need to communicate with him that there are certain tings that his age precludes him from doing. He can't stay up as late as you. He can't play a pickup game of basketball with your adult friends. You don't need to lie to the kid at all. Just tell him that he's too young to play.

hodayathink

12-21-2007, 07:51 PM

The point was that you need to communicate with him that there are certain tings that his age precludes him from doing. He can't stay up as late as you. He can't play a pickup game of basketball with your adult friends. You don't need to lie to the kid at all. Just tell him that he's too young to play.

But the thing is that he's not too young to play. He's too young to play well. I've seen plenty of people enjoy playing games where they sucked somewhere between badly and horribly at. Especially really young kids, like in this example. And in the end, video games are about enjoyment more than anything else.

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 07:56 PM

dfjdejulio

12-21-2007, 08:19 PM

Most video games are too hard for very young children. A 3 year old likely won't be playing Super Mario World. Sure the game is about enjoyment but at some point you need to start being practical. Most games aren't designed for young children and they need to understand that.

But if I can instead simply enter a cheat code that makes it appropriate for him, I'm going to prefer that.

I cannot for the life of me understand why you would oppose such a thing, as you seem to. If it has no impact on you (not even on leaderboards or online matches), why could it possibly bother you?

I just bought the game "Boom Boom Rocket", which also uses the guitar controllers. It has a mode that isn't scored where you can't lose and nothing you do or fail to do with the controller is punished. You don't make progress, you don't get on leaderboards, but you can pick up the controller and fiddle. I'm going to let my nephew play with that. Does this deeply offend you for some reason? It seems like if you're consistent, it would.

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 08:36 PM

But if I can instead simply enter a cheat code that makes it appropriate for him, I'm going to prefer that.

I cannot for the life of me understand why you would oppose such a thing, as you seem to. If it has no impact on you (not even on leaderboards or online matches), why could it possibly bother you?

You're not very bright. I am not opposed to the idea. I never said that I was. in fact, I said that I don't care if it is put in. I was specifically questioning one guy about why he couldn't tell his nephew the reason he couldn't play the game. Do me a favor and learn to read before you just start making stuff up about my position on a cheat.

Ultrace

12-21-2007, 09:13 PM

I just bought the game "Boom Boom Rocket", which also uses the guitar controllers. It has a mode that isn't scored where you can't lose and nothing you do or fail to do with the controller is punished. You don't make progress, you don't get on leaderboards, but you can pick up the controller and fiddle. I'm going to let my nephew play with that. Does this deeply offend you for some reason? It seems like if you're consistent, it would.
Actually, consistency would be saying that it's fine for Boom Boom Rocket to operate like that because that's how it was designed by the people who developed it. They didn't release the game and then decide by public request to add features to make the game easier. They made a product, released it, and that's that. Have they moved to add modes and features to the game post-release to make it easier? That would be more akin to what's being proposed here.

Does it directly affect or hurt me to have this mode added? No, but it does take away development time from things that I feel would be more important to the game. I don't feel that an option to turn off the kick pedal is more important than adjusting some of the quirks of BWT, or creating DLC (songs and more), for instance. Others may disagree with me, but that's their choice.

WorldWarJack

12-21-2007, 09:49 PM

Actually, consistency would be saying that it's fine for Boom Boom Rocket to operate like that because that's how it was designed by the people who developed it. They didn't release the game and then decide by public request to add features to make the game easier. They made a product, released it, and that's that. Have they moved to add modes and features to the game post-release to make it easier? That would be more akin to what's being proposed here.

Does it directly affect or hurt me to have this mode added? No, but it does take away development time from things that I feel would be more important to the game. I don't feel that an option to turn off the kick pedal is more important than adjusting some of the quirks of BWT, or creating DLC (songs and more), for instance. Others may disagree with me, but that's their choice.

I'm sorry. I was misinformed. I feel like such an idiot. I had no idea this game was made for you. By all means let the development team focus all their time and energy on ways to only make the game more enjoyable for you. Forget everyone else and their woes. Let's just focus on what YOU want. and what YOU feel are important additions to the game. Again, I feel like such an idiot. I never even noticed your name on my copy of the game or any of the instruments i've been using. If you give me your address I'll be more than happy to pack up the gameand ship it on out to you, since clearly this game was designed for you and you alone. Again, my apologies.

NattyLight

12-21-2007, 10:14 PM

I'm sorry. I was misinformed. I feel like such an idiot. I had no idea this game was made for you. By all means let the development team focus all their time and energy on ways to only make the game more enjoyable for you. Forget everyone else and their woes. Let's just focus on what YOU want. and what YOU feel are important additions to the game. Again, I feel like such an idiot. I never even noticed your name on my copy of the game or any of the instruments i've been using. If you give me your address I'll be more than happy to pack up the gameand ship it on out to you, since clearly this game was designed for you and you alone. Again, my apologies.

It's funny that you're making fun of him by using a statement that is completely accurate of yourself.

You want HMX to change the game because you think it's too hard. Read what you wrote and then apply to it yourself.

espher

12-21-2007, 10:21 PM

There are not enough tears.

hodayathink

12-22-2007, 12:54 AM

Yea he's too young to play because he is too young to play well. He can't play that same adult basketball game because he is too young. Sure he can throw a ball at a hoop but he's too young to do anything resembling competition with it. Is this really too hard a concept for you to understand?

Most video games are too hard for very young children. A 3 year old likely won't be playing Super Mario World. Sure the game is about enjoyment but at some point you need to start being practical. Most games aren't designed for young children and they need to understand that.
My point is that you don't have to be able to play a game well to enjoy it. As long as everything else in the game is age appopriate (no foul language or even semi-graphic violence), I don't see why a child shouldn't be able to play any video game, as long as they are having fun.

Kevhouse

12-22-2007, 02:24 AM

NattyLight

12-22-2007, 02:55 AM

My point is that you don't have to be able to play a game well to enjoy it. As long as everything else in the game is age appopriate (no foul language or even semi-graphic violence), I don't see why a child shouldn't be able to play any video game, as long as they are having fun.

Like I said, you're dumb.

You don't have to play baseball well to enjoy it and there is no graphic language or violence in the game. 3 year olds are still too young to play because they lack the hand-eye coordination to do so. A child shouldn't play a game if they're too young to be coordinated enough to play it. If they have fun failing, more power to them

You have some pretty ******ed reasoning for your line of thinking. You don't do much reasoning day to day, do you?

Since this is such a big topic to tackle I'll start with some of the basics...

After you take a **** you'll want to rip off a 4-8 square length (depending on the size of the dump you just took) of toilet paper from the roll. I like to layer it so that there is a bi-leveled layer of TP between my fingers and my *******. Then you are going to want to wipe from front to back. Afterwards, take a look at the TP in your hand. The amount of feces on the paper will directly correlate to how many more times you have to repeat the process.

If there isn't too much **** on the paper, then one more wipe will probably suffice. If, however, you are dealing with a $0.05 wing night/$1 draft type dump you may have to repeat the process as many as 6 times before you are clean. In the extreme cases (5-plate trip to the Indian Buffet for example) you may need to follow up the wiping with a hop into the shower and a quick once-over with your sister's/mom's/girlfriend's loofa.

Get back to me when you've grasped this concept and we'll move on from there to children playing games that weren't designed for them. Good luck.

SSPWOLF

12-22-2007, 03:10 AM

I hate this pathetic excuse that most people aren't coordinated to use 3 limbs. Just because you can't do something doesn't mean that others are as inept. most people CAN use 3 limbs after just a few minutes of practice.

I don't have a problem using all four of my limbs.

If your argument held weight there wouldn't be hundreds of posts on these forums begging HMX to let them play the drums with auto-kick

Personally, Natty, i've been playing drums and percussion for 21 years. I've also instructed percussion theory and taught many people how to play a kit. You're personal theories on learning things might be "you're excuses are pathetic and you are inept if you can't do it" but I find that it actually rings true that MOST people can't sit down at a drum kit thier first time and start playing beats with double kick pedals. Or even use the hi-hat properly.

Just because you can stomp on two pedals and smack a few drums and cymbals doesn't mean you can do anything resembling playing a beat. If you know anyone who can sit down thier first time and grasp the concept of all four limbs moving together and play solid beats immediately they are what we in the proffessional music world refer to as "a natural"

SSPWOLF

12-22-2007, 03:13 AM

And another point I'd like to make... outside of the world of "heavy metal drum gods" there's an entire group of amazing drummers called "jazz players" many of which play without a hi-hat at all. I've also personally known a number of drummers who played standing up and only used one pedal.

I don't personally know any professional jazz players who use double-kick, though I know many who use a hi-hat pedal. Either way the most talented drummers I know would feel just as comfortable on a kit without a hi-hat at all as they would on Niel Peart's kit.

NattyLight

12-22-2007, 03:23 AM

I don't have a problem using all four of my limbs.

If your argument held weight there wouldn't be hundreds of posts on these forums begging HMX to let them play the drums with auto-kick

Personally, Natty, i've been playing drums and percussion for 21 years. I've also instructed percussion theory and taught many people how to play a kit. You're personal theories on learning things might be "you're excuses are pathetic and you are inept if you can't do it" but I find that it actually rings true that MOST people can't sit down at a drum kit thier first time and start playing beats with double kick pedals. Or even use the hi-hat properly.

Just because you can stomp on two pedals and smack a few drums and cymbals doesn't mean you can do anything resembling playing a beat. If you know anyone who can sit down thier first time and grasp the concept of all four limbs moving together and play solid beats immediately they are what we in the proffessional music world refer to as "a natural"

How you idiots managed to jump from Idiocracy to this forum is beyond me. You haven't played and taught drums for 21 years if you actually think that most people can't sit down and learn a standard beat in a matter of minutes. You prove your ignorance by saying that you need to move all four limbs independently to do so. For the basic beats, you only need to move 3 limbs.

And another point I'd like to make... outside of the world of "heavy metal drum gods" there's an entire group of amazing drummers called "jazz players" many of which play without a hi-hat at all. I've also personally known a number of drummers who played standing up and only used one pedal.

I don't personally know any professional jazz players who use double-kick, though I know many who use a hi-hat pedal. Either way the most talented drummers I know would feel just as comfortable on a kit without a hi-hat at all as they would on Niel Peart's kit.

You don't use a hi-hat pedal or a double kick at all in this game. not even on expert mode. Anything that has a double pedal is alternating beats in this game. We're talking about easy mode and you're talking out of your ass. You also don't need that pedal of a double kick for a standard beat.

I'm done even discussing this with anybody that can't use simple reasoning or read what I wrote. If I wanted to debate with toddlers, I'd be in a preschool with kids that eat paste instead of here with you all that eat it. I sincerely hope you get cancer and die. Soon. I don't want you infecting our gene pool with your utter stupidity.

espher

12-22-2007, 03:34 AM

Like I said, you're dumb.

There's a right way and a wrong way to be a dick on these forums, and in case you haven't figured it out, you're doing it wrong.

WiseOldUnicorn

12-22-2007, 03:49 AM

One thing to keep in mind about how difficult it is for people to play drums in Rock Band is that a lot of them have never played a music game before in their lives. It takes a bit of experience to get the hang of figuring out how to time what you're doing to what's showing up on the screen, learning to focus less on the bar at the bottom and more on what's coming up ahead, playing in time to the beat instead of fixating on the bar, etc.

Yeah, you can get the hang of it pretty easily after a few songs, but having to figure that out on TOP of having to coordinate three limbs, especially considering that some people have no coordination or rhythm whatsoever...yeah. Don't underestimate the difficulty. And it's because of that that how easy or difficult it is to pick up real drums has absolutely 0% bearing on drums in RB.

Dr.Strangelove

12-22-2007, 03:54 AM

I agree with this wholeheartedly as my effin' bass pedal just snapped in half after less than a month's usage, yeah i'm gonna get another one from harmonix, but that won't be until after christmas.

Majic19

12-22-2007, 04:01 AM

Like I said, you're dumb.

You don't have to play baseball well to enjoy it and there is no graphic language or violence in the game. 3 year olds are still too young to play because they lack the hand-eye coordination to do so. A child shouldn't play a game if they're too young to be coordinated enough to play it. If they have fun failing, more power to them

You have some pretty ******ed reasoning for your line of thinking. You don't do much reasoning day to day, do you?

Since this is such a big topic to tackle I'll start with some of the basics...

After you take a **** you'll want to rip off a 4-8 square length (depending on the size of the dump you just took) of toilet paper from the roll. I like to layer it so that there is a bi-leveled layer of TP between my fingers and my *******. Then you are going to want to wipe from front to back. Afterwards, take a look at the TP in your hand. The amount of feces on the paper will directly correlate to how many more times you have to repeat the process.

If there isn't too much **** on the paper, then one more wipe will probably suffice. If, however, you are dealing with a $0.05 wing night/$1 draft type dump you may have to repeat the process as many as 6 times before you are clean. In the extreme cases (5-plate trip to the Indian Buffet for example) you may need to follow up the wiping with a hop into the shower and a quick once-over with your sister's/mom's/girlfriend's loofa.

Get back to me when you've grasped this concept and we'll move on from there to children playing games that weren't designed for them. Good luck.

Natty,

You are completely missing the point. And calling people dumb, as you have done more than once in this thread, just because they disagree with you isn't exactly a ringing endorsement of your intelligence. But I'll get to my point rather than personally (not "physically") attacking you as you seem to feel is the appropriate way to respond.

I have been playing the drums for over 30 years. I have taught hundreds of drummers, over the course of 15 years, ranging from beginners to some of the most talented drummers I've known. And any instructor who takes a completely inexperienced drummer and teaches him to play 4/4 rhythms within "5 minutes" of them walking off the street is a load of BS, especially if they are very young. Not to mention they will be doing a great disservice to the student. Most beginning drummers do not have the limb dexterity to play a simple 4/4 beat on the drums until after weeks of practice. Most people, other than musicians,have never had to separate independent appendages using different speeds and timing of two limbs simultaneously let alone all four. (or 3 as is the case in RB). (ask the average Joe to pat his head while rubbing his stomache... it's quite amusing watching them try). And any instructor worth his fees would spend time teaching proper technique and rudiments before even jumping into the simplest rhythms involving base pedals and high hats. But, again, this was not the point of this thread.

This is just a game!!! It is designed to have fun. And this game in particular is designed to have fun as group. And although this may come as complete shock to someone as adept as you, a lot of people such as myself, actually enjoy playing "pick up games of basketball" with our 5 year old sons and look forward to enjoying Rock band with them as well. And just because my son is obviously not old enough nor big enough to go out and pay on my Men's League basketball team does not mean that I should go take away his basketball and tell him that since he can not compete at that level he should no be allowed to play at all. And according to you I should be a better parent (by your definition) and teach him some sort of life lesson rather than just having some fun with him in another activity I've loved for many years, such as playing in a rock band.

As drummer and a drum instructor, having the ability to disable the base pedal while young, inexperienced or rhythmly challenged individuals learn basic hand dexterity and rudiment techniques first... then introduce the 3rd aspect to them (the foot pedal), this would be great way to teach them to play. If they pick it up in 5 minutes; great, disable the cheat. But at least this way this would make the game very enjoyable for a lot of people who can not learn to play a 4/4 rhythm in 5 minutes, like my 5 year old who loves to play the drums (Even though by your standards he is too young and should be sent to his room for wanting to play with daddy).

Make it so the records and leader boards are disabled while this cheat is in use and let the kids have fun too. But do yourself a favor and step down off your high horse for a minute and realize that just because we are not all as awesome as you are, does not mean we are ******ed or handicapped. Maybe we just want to have fun with our kids/neices/nephews/siblings etc. without having to prove to the world how wonderful we are or trying to set any records... if that's okay with you???

SSPWOLF

12-22-2007, 04:03 AM

How you idiots managed to jump from Idiocracy to this forum is beyond me. You haven't played and taught drums for 21 years if you actually think that most people can't sit down and learn a standard beat in a matter of minutes. You prove your ignorance by saying that you need to move all four limbs independently to do so. For the basic beats, you only need to move 3 limbs.

You don't use a hi-hat pedal or a double kick at all in this game. not even on expert mode. Anything that has a double pedal is alternating beats in this game. We're talking about easy mode and you're talking out of your ass. You also don't need that pedal of a double kick for a standard beat.

I'm done even discussing this with anybody that can't use simple reasoning or read what I wrote. If I wanted to debate with toddlers, I'd be in a preschool with kids that eat paste instead of here with you all that eat it. I sincerely hope you get cancer and die. Soon. I don't want you infecting our gene pool with your utter stupidity.

If your idea of a debate is to projectile spew mean-spirited jabs at the person you are talking to, then I'm sure you are the local redneck-bar champion. On the other hand if presenting an intelligent argument based on fact and opinion and recognizing that other people may be inclined to disagree with you based upon thier personal reasoning is what you are going for then you fail miserably.

While agree that discussing things with toddlers is pointless, you may need to glance in the mirror. "You're an idiot! That's my tonka truck!"

"You're stupid! Learn the simple concept of defecating and wiping!"

Are you serious? I mean, do you honestly think that your arguments are convincing or anything other than "cute in an angsty anger-filled teenager" way?

Your social ineptivity is simply shrieking for more ritalin.

I think perhaps you need to step away from the computer and listen to some Yanni or something.

You are a collosal douche with an inability to operate within the parameters of polite society, which.. in many circles is an admirable quality. I would suggest surrounding yourself with other 12-16 year olds who also think "he who cusses loudest and ridicules most wins!"

The rest of us will discuss conversations based on merit, objectivity, and the ability to communicate with other humans without faking a pretense of superiority due to our own latent inferiority complex rearing it's ugly head.

In short, Sir, the anonymous nature of the internet can't hide the fact that you're a *****, but I'm still amused to know that a ***** is a ***** whether he types well or uses internet L33t Sp3ak.

Majic19

12-22-2007, 04:14 AM

If your idea of a debate is to projectile spew mean-spirited jabs at the person you are talking to, then I'm sure you are the local redneck-bar champion. On the other hand if presenting an intelligent argument based on fact and opinion and recognizing that other people may be inclined to disagree with you based upon thier personal reasoning is what you are going for then you fail miserably.

While agree that discussing things with toddlers is pointless, you may need to glance in the mirror. "You're an idiot! That's my tonka truck!"

"You're stupid! Learn the simple concept of defecating and wiping!"

Are you serious? I mean, do you honestly think that your arguments are convincing or anything other than "cute in an angsty anger-filled teenager" way?

Your social ineptivity is simply shrieking for more ritalin.

I think perhaps you need to step away from the computer and listen to some Yanni or something.

You are a collosal douche with an inability to operate within the parameters of polite society, which.. in many circles is an admirable quality. I would suggest surrounding yourself with other 12-16 year olds who also think "he who cusses loudest and ridicules most wins!"

The rest of us will discuss conversations based on merit, objectivity, and the ability to communicate with other humans without faking a pretense of superiority due to our own latent inferiority complex rearing it's ugly head.

In short, Sir, the anonymous nature of the internet can't hide the fact that you're a *****, but I'm still amused to know that a ***** is a ***** whether he types well or uses internet L33t Sp3ak.

Now that is funny... and entertaining. May I just add my "Ditto"!!!

Well said SSPWolf

REICHLEIN

12-22-2007, 07:17 AM

Two more cents...

First off, there is no reason to get mean and resort to name calling. That's downright childish. That being said, let's get down to the nitty gritty.

I have two kids, one is 5 and the other 6 (both I am happy to say are better behaved and mannered than some people on this forum). As a musician, I would love to get my kids in to my biggest passion, and Rock Band seems to be the best way to do it. The problem I'm facing, and it sounds like I'm not the only one, is that at that age, the coordination isn't there. A cheat to disable the kick pedal would be a wonderful thing. Kids do not have a very long attention span as it is, and it gets even shorter when they get frustrated. And that being said a way to turn off the song failed thing when they miss too many beats would be a good thing as well.

Also for those that think that drumming is easy... I have been a musician now for about 20 years. I started out with the saxophone, taking state solo competition my senior year, picked up upright bass in high school, and moved to electric shortly after. Then I learned guitar as well. I am still having a problem with the drums. I can make it through anything on easy, although not always gracefully (it's that d*mn kick). So please, cut these folks some slack.

Now as far as a double kick is concerned. I would like to see this as a 3rd party add on. A good portion of these songs were recorded using a double kick, and (somebody please correct me if I'm wrong) from what I understand, expert mode is the actual recorded drum parts. We all know that drummers such as Lars Ulrich and Neal Peart use double kicks, and it would make hitting those double and triple kicks a lot easier and more realistic.

SSPWOLF

12-22-2007, 07:36 AM

I agree, "one size fits all" doesn't work when it comes to music, and this game isn't marketed towards "expert musicians" it's marketed towards "people who play video games."

for the elitist jerks out there, you can purchase the "I'm an elitist jerk who doesn't think the game should be fun for people who aren't professional musicians" version of Rockband at www.musiciansfriend.com It has wonderful peripherals. I suggest the Roland V-Drums, any PRS guitar, a nice gibson bass, and a Rhodes microphone.

For those of you having trouble with the kick pedal on the drums... may I suggest, in lieu of a cheat which may never happen, having your kids play in practice mode, or on the first tier songs.

My wife wanted to try the drums and she was incapable of getting it down at first. I played along with her on the guitar and made sure I kept Overdrive power so I could save her when she failed. Eventually, with a lot of encouragement, she was able to get it. On a couple of songs I took over the kick pedal for her.

This is what I would suggest for those who are trying to get thier kids into it.. play the kick for them, and if they are good enough to get "some" of the song right with the kick, then play along with them so that you can save them with overdrive.

It may not be THE answer, but it's a lot more helpful than some jackass belittling everyone.

chute

12-22-2007, 05:13 PM

Of course the kick pedal is hard. That's why they made it orange.

Has everyone forgotten that easy mode on the guitar part only requires Green, Red, and Yellow? Yet for drums, you're expected to pick up all 5 points of contact right off the bat?

espher

12-22-2007, 05:25 PM

Without getting too far into it, I just want to say I'm not a fan of necessarily making games accessible for everyone in the sense of disabling critical yet challenging parts of the game simply to allow everyone to pick up and play.

The kick pedal is a pretty crucial part of the drum setup and being (relatively) eased into it with easy makes the transitions to higher difficulties that much better.

My personal experience with the pedal has been:

a) People with previous GH experience tend to pick up the drums easier than those without, probably since reading the charts is not a factor (as has been mentioned) -- out of my friends that played more than once, three previous GH players picked it up fine, one struggled a bit but eventually got it; one non-GH player picked it up fine, two did not (one eventually did, but much slower, and the other tried a couple of times and just gave up.
b) People who think the pedal is stupid on easy generally play the drums once on a song (which is not an 'early' easy song because they jump in with a group), struggle/fail once, and refuse to try again.
c) People who are okay with the pedal on easy either picked it up right away or didn't give up despite a couple of close calls or outright failures.
d) The GH playing crew generally didn't stay on easy for long.

It's worth noting that the game is rated T, primarily for content but one could also argue for lack of ease of play, so it may not be appropriate for very young kids. If the young kids can play it fine, great, but I don't think removing the kick pedal on easy is the right solution for easy or for getting kids to play, even in a cheat code or non-scored mode.

I don't know how coherent I am on this but it's just what I've seen and feel personally, and I won't hold it against anyone if they don't agree.

Kevhouse

12-22-2007, 05:25 PM

Has everyone forgotten that easy mode on the guitar part only requires Green, Red, and Yellow? Yet for drums, you're expected to pick up all 5 points of contact right off the bat?

This is what everyone was saying at first. I honestly think it was a good idea to start it off harder. Otherwise everyone would be complaining about how boring it would be to only use three drum pads on easy, and how hard was soooo hard when bringing in the bass pedal. let's face it, people are going to complain about it no matter what. you're better off just accepting the fact that it's not gonna be easy, practicing, and working your way up, just like you did on guitar. just because you can pick up a guitar and play expert, doesnt mean you can play expert on drums the first time. could you play expert on the guitar the first time you picked it up? of course not. it takes PRACTICE and PATIENCE, people.

HypodermicMD

12-22-2007, 11:14 PM

espher

12-22-2007, 11:37 PM

The utter lack of compassion for people who are disabled and or are just unable to play that game the way <i>you</i> think it should be is surprising and disgusting. Just because someone has no use of their legs doesn't make them inept or in need of more practice. I've read a few threads where this has come up, and again, the lack of support for kids wanting to play or disabled persons wanting to play is pathetic. It doesn't affect <i>your</i> game, and it makes someone else's life more enjoyable. It must rock, having the world revolve around you where everyone else is just there in your wake. Grow the hell up.

To me, it's funny that the same crew giving people grief for wanting the game tailored to their desires are the same people who want the game tailored to their own desires.

The line needs to be drawn somewhere, and while I'm not necessarily opposed to the cause, the drums are but a fraction of the game, and not everyone can easily play every game type.

I wouldn't throw a fit if this mode was implemented, but the only plausible reason or justification (to me) I have seen so far is so that someone with a lower-body disability could play the drums -- and even then, it'd be something that would be nice to have, not something that people should be demanding as thought they are entitled to it.

Honestly, should we have a fret-to-speech option for the blind? Should Harmonix incorporate technology that interprets brainwaves so someone who is mute can play the vocal campaign? What about an auto-pad mode so someone with an upper-body disability can still play the drums? Of course, then we might have to make a special guitar controller that allows them to play with their feet too.

It might sound absurd, but then again, so are the accusations of RE5 being racist, and we all know those are in play.

Edit: Perhaps all of the energy here would be better invested in making a peripheral that would allow someone with a disability to play the bass pedal. Either some sort of hand operated device or hell maybe we can work something out with air through a straw. The pedal itself is a very simple device.

Kevhouse

12-22-2007, 11:39 PM

I hope your post was not directed towards me. I am clearly not referring to anybody who is disabled. not once did I bash any of these people. I have also read these threads, and my sympathy to those people. I am referring to those people out there that just say "oh man, bass pedal? THIS IS SO HARD! WHY CAN'T IT BE EASIER?" That is what the poster I replied to was stating. Still, a patch is probably not going to happen. If you are disabled, my deepest symathies, but you will not be able to use the bass pedal as others do. A patch for this is very unlikely. Yes, there have been real drummers before who have been disabled, but unfortunately they cannot play rock band. My suggestion to those of you who are disabled and want to play, forget a stupid game like this and be great learning a real drum set.

Think before you open your mouth and automatically assume I'm attacking a group, when I never once suggested it. Talk about people who need to grow up...

SSPWOLF

12-23-2007, 02:19 AM

toefer2

12-23-2007, 03:04 AM

Where do any of you get the moral highground from which to do anything other than make observations anyway?

This whole conversation reminds me of a bunch 1985 High Schol Football State Champions sitting around a construction yard on thier lunch break *****ing about how stupid the head coach of the Dallas Cowboys is and how they could all do a better job, then it turns into a fist fight when two people get into an argument over whether Tony Romo is as good as Troy Aikman or not.

Seriously, if the issue doesn't effect you.. then what's the point of becoming married to your opinion enough to actually defend it? If the issue does effect you then why are you arguing it with monkeys on a forum?

At this point it's obvious that the parties involved in the discussion don't care about the issue, they care about "proving points" and being seen as "right".

This isn't the abortion debate, lives are not at stake here.

I never cease to be amazed at the ability for perfect strangers to become *****s to each other over the most mundane and insignificant things.

Happy Holidays.

Well said.

I would definitely like to see some sort of patch, if only to help out disabled people. I can see how others might use it to cheat, but oh well. I never really cared that much about online rankings, and that sort of thing, to really care if people are cheating or not (unless its something like a shooting game, and their cheating directly affects my playing experience).

I have plenty of non-disabled friends and family who see RB and want to play the drums, but don't have the spare minutes it apparently takes to get down the arm/leg coordination. Just the other day, I had to play the bass pedal while playing guitar, so my sister could play along on the drums.

Also, the whole text-to-speech, brainwave signal, etc. type stuff to accommodate every disability is an absurd argument. In the demo versions of the game, the bass pedal was played automatically, since the demos shipped without the pedal. So in a sense it's something that HMX already made, and would seem easy to implement, as opposed to something they'd have to go work on for a few weeks, which would distract them from their Led Zeppelin DLC negotiations.

When did games cross over from a way of having fun, to being so competitive?

REICHLEIN

12-23-2007, 03:18 AM

Okay, it's another night, and I'm back. So we're still arguing here are we? This will be my last post in this thread, and I'm only going to say one thing.

I will not wrestle with a pig.
We would both get dirty, but the pig would like it.

TNTales

12-23-2007, 03:27 AM

I could understand a certain level of difficulty in a single player game or in a competitive mulitplayer game. But RB is a party game and is most fun when played with more than one person in front of your big old TV. I don't like that when people come over and want to play the difficulty built in (especially the fan cap in BWT) that discourages casual play.

GH3 went in this direction by catering to the difficulty junkies, even going so far as to chart notes that aren't in the song (try playing some of the songs on harder difficulties, it doesn't "feel" like your playing the song, dont' know how to describe it). RB had/has the chance to be a game that is accessible, and is that not Harmonix mission statement?

"To make the joy of making music available to everyone" especially those who aren't particularly good at real instruments. The great thing about the early GHs was the FEELING you were PLAYING. It had the ability to suck you in and emulate the FEELING of making music.

I play guitar (have for a few years) and it's amazing how GH/RB translates the feeling of making music even if it doesn't on a 5 note button stick with a toggle.

So things like a disabled kick pedal would seem to me to match up with the intent of the developers (at least their stated intent). It's no fun to have a party game that only game junkies like us can play. We could just not have the leaderboard as far as I'm concerned.

How important is a sliver of data showing that you have entirely too much time on your hands? I mean, really. If the great big server went down tomorrow the only thing that would change is that the world wouldn't know that living in your mom's basement was still cool because you can beat Green Grass and High Tides on Expert playing 2 instruments at once.

Make it a game that people can play together. I agree with the above poster, why do games have to be competitively difficult? If anything the leaderboard concept seems a bit tacked on. If anything make the competitive stuff, like the leaderboard, optional. Then those who want to grind themselves to bug-eyed nubs can all be together and the rest of us can enjoy the game.

espher

12-23-2007, 04:36 AM

Also, the whole text-to-speech, brainwave signal, etc. type stuff to accommodate every disability is an absurd argument.

The whole point was that it's absurd but it's where the slippery slope will lead. Harmonix's goal is to make music more accessible, but if we expect them to allow someone to experience playing drums by removing one of the main elements of playing drums, we're already moving in that direction.

You will have people requesting auto-strumming so someone with the use of only one hand can play the guitar. You will have people asking for text-to-speech for the blind. It will go from there. I'm not saying you'll see it right here right now, but while absurd it's still not impossible.

Again, I have no problem with them catering to someone with a disability if they do so, but you've got to keep in mind that this issue is not solely an issue of someone with a disability being unable to play.

We're also talking about people who do not want to invest the time or effort to practice and hone their ability. Personally, I am not a fan of lowering the difficulty of anything that is challenging simply because someone is not able to successfully complete it. I do not like coddling someone who is struggling and not willing to put in the effort to succeed at the most BASIC level of the game.

We're also talking about people who lack even the most basic of rhythm skills that are required to play a rhythm game. I do not expect a racing sim to automatically handle acceleration and braking for me if I can't get the hang of it on even the simplest of tracks (although I will admit some do). I do not expect a first person shooter to take over aiming for me (even on the easiest of difficulties) so all I need to do is press the trigger because I have trouble using dual analog sticks (although some do provide aim assist as an option). There's a trend that's been started of making games simple beyond the simplest difficulty to compensate for a basic inability to play the game with some brainpower (I'm looking at you, 1/6th damage taken & 6x damage dealt setting in Oblivion) that I personally do not care for.

(As an aside, let me just highlight that real quick: this is not a party game, it's a music rhythm game that happens to be a great party game. It's not a party game that happens to involve rhythm. There's some perception that, because it's a fun multiplayer game in a party atmosphere, it's automatically a party game, and it shouldn't be too challenging. It's not Mario Party or Scene It! or Nintendo Wii Minigame Collection X.)

So you can't really expect me to not throw in my opinion on a thread on a discussion forum even if it doesn't 'affect' me directly. If you don't want it discussed, don't post a thread. This is a forum, not a journal.

If someone has a physical hindrance, then I am certainly sympathetic to their plight, but expecting Harmonix to remove part of the core game to suit that need and then giving someone grief for disagreeing is just as much of a '***** move' as you would view someone saying that this isn't an idea they area with, if not more so.

I'm personally looking forward to seeing some innovative hardware solutions, something along the line of what have with spinner knobs, hand controls, and swivel boards for cars. Let's make some drumsticks that will sense extra pressure along where you're holding them so that a quick squeeze will send a pedal hit through. Let's get a device built that will allow someone to blow in a straw to signal the kick pedal.

There are tons of people making drum mods -- why not find a way that will keep the challenge but not restrict the experience? Or is the challenge really more of a problem?

There were people with upper-body disabilities who played NES controllers with their feet, and they didn't ask Nintendo to make special controllers or changes to the game to make the game more viable as a result of their disability.

Edit: I just want to stress here I'm not 'lacking compassion' for people with a disability because I do not support this suggested change. Let's not turn this into a 'if you don't support the war you support the terrorists' type of thing, eh?

RyBu

12-23-2007, 05:17 AM

We could just not have the leaderboard as far as I'm concerned.

How important is a sliver of data showing that you have entirely too much time on your hands? I mean, really. If the great big server went down tomorrow the only thing that would change is that the world wouldn't know that living in your mom's basement was still cool because you can beat Green Grass and High Tides on Expert playing 2 instruments at once.

Make it a game that people can play together. I agree with the above poster, why do games have to be competitively difficult? If anything the leaderboard concept seems a bit tacked on. If anything make the competitive stuff, like the leaderboard, optional. Then those who want to grind themselves to bug-eyed nubs can all be together and the rest of us can enjoy the game.

This is where you went wrong. You're attacking a seperate aspect of the game for NO REASON, and an aspect that I'm sure most people appriciate.

Games are GAMES, but there is a degree of competition. I can tell you right now without the leaderboards, my friends and I would be playing GH. SOME people need competition in order to get better. It's also a replay value.

If there weren't other bands/players out there doing anything special, and I was the greatest always will be, forever and ever... why even play? To boost my own ego? EVERY PERSON ON THIS FORUM HAS CHECKED THIER LEADERBOARDS. People want to know how well they do, and they want to see what they're up against.

And to the

How important is a sliver of data showing that you have entirely too much time on your hands?

comment.... seems a little bitter don't you think? There is such a thing as talent. You think that all the drummers who play this, and have the ability to play on expert, and play well for that matter are ONLY there because they don't have lives and play ALL DAY ALL NIGHT? Wrong. You had some validity in the beginning of your post, but lost it all when you started babbling about leaderboards. Stick to the topic.

KillAutumn

12-23-2007, 05:21 AM

I agree. with RyBu.

I use the vocal leaderboard as a method to judge how well I'm doing. When I finished the vocals on Medium and saw I was on 3500, it made me feel good. Why? Because on Guitar Hero I was always 21,120 best, and that was discouraging. Every time I see I've moved up a 100, I always tell myself. "I can sing this song better and move up just a little more..."

Now I'm 1,300 best! Not anything special...But hey, someone on my friends list is 32,000th best. Now that makes me feel important.

EDIT: I'm actually 1,137 on the 360 Leaderboards right now. It helps me want to get better, and I really enjoy singing. =D

SSPWOLF

12-24-2007, 10:24 AM

I'll save space by not quoting directly... but relevant points will ensue

1) The "slippery slope of people getting what they want and then opening pandora's box for more people getting what they want". Have you ever seen posts claiming "Easy on guitar is way too difficult." ? Have you ever seen "Easy on vocals is way too difficult."?

There's a reason why hundreds of people are posting to request an auto-kick. Because for them EASY on the drums IS too difficult.

You can argue from your soap box that the are lazy and that they aren't real gamers all day, no matter how many paragraphs you type to support your theory, the fundamental gist of your logic is that you believe they should "suck it up and get better". They disagree with you.

It's been proposed a dozen times by people requesting this that a cheat be made WITH the leaderboards and access to rock central disabled. How could this possibly affect you?

Your logic that "it opens the door for other things" is the equivalent of assuming the employees of Harmonix are all utter morons. Do you honestly think if they make a move to appease a percentage of fans with an auto-kick feature that they are suddenly gonna go "Well, f*ck, now we gotta make a version for deaf people." ??

2) Your assertion as to what the game is and is-not is entirely subjective. Harmonix classifies the game as a Music Rythym Game, that's the genre. However, they *market* it in many different ways. At the end of the day, to Harmonix, it's a product they intend to make money off of. I don't believe you'll ever see a HMX employee do a press release saying "Well, we only want a certain type of person playing this game. Anyone who doesn't fit our target demographic should probably just not play the game."

Pick up and play is VERY important. With a game like this.. a significant number of people have no idea that they'd ever like it. MOST of the people I know hear I bought Rock Band and they snicker.. Rock Band, at least in the 20 and up crowd that I hang out with isn't exactly considered "cool". HOWEVER anytime my friends come over and play.. they usually go "Oh wow, this is FUN!"

Making the drums more accessible to amatuer players would aid this.

My final point, which someone else has made before and bears repeating is:

Vocals on easy = Sing somewhat on rythym and either "high" or "low" and you'll pass.

Guitar on easy = use only THREE different fret buttons and the fastest you have to play is RARELY 8th notes.

Drums on easy = Use four pads, two arms, plus a kick pedal and a foot.

there's a dynamic difference in EASY across the 3 types of instrument.

I've had a lot of different people play my RB game. People who play a lot of GH usually can play the drums on medium after 15-30 minutes of practice.

People who have never played GH before but are drummers in real life have come over and been able to go straight to medium.. only failing out a few times due to not having a firm grasp on how the note-scroll works.

I've had about 4 different people who've never played real drums or guitar hero (or similar games) before and they have always had significant difficulty being able to play the drums on easy. What always happens is they have a little fun, get frustrated, and end up on guitar or vocals and don't ever really care to go back to playing drums.

All of these people have either already bought, or plan on buying the standalone game (or the guitar only version).

SSPWOLF

12-24-2007, 10:35 AM

This is where you went wrong. You're attacking a seperate aspect of the game for NO REASON, and an aspect that I'm sure most people appriciate.

Games are GAMES, but there is a degree of competition. I can tell you right now without the leaderboards, my friends and I would be playing GH. SOME people need competition in order to get better. It's also a replay value.

If there weren't other bands/players out there doing anything special, and I was the greatest always will be, forever and ever... why even play? To boost my own ego? EVERY PERSON ON THIS FORUM HAS CHECKED THIER LEADERBOARDS. People want to know how well they do, and they want to see what they're up against.

And to the

comment.... seems a little bitter don't you think? There is such a thing as talent. You think that all the drummers who play this, and have the ability to play on expert, and play well for that matter are ONLY there because they don't have lives and play ALL DAY ALL NIGHT? Wrong. You had some validity in the beginning of your post, but lost it all when you started babbling about leaderboards. Stick to the topic.

Your argument is well formed, however it's entirely one-sided.

My wife plays rock band all the time and she's never checked out the leaderboards.

Many people DON'T play this game to compete. They play it because it's fun.

A game like Mass Effect takes 30 hours to complete... there aren't any leaderboards in that game.. but it's sold a million or so copies.

While I competely agree that most people are competitive by nature, especially when it comes to friendly competition... the idea that high score and leaderboards are the only way to compete is preposterous.

Many of us play to challenge ourselves. Just as you assume everyone needs leaderboards in order for the game to have replay value...

I myself will assume and assert that the single MOST important factor of the game is the feeling you get when you nail something difficult. That feeling when you see "skittles" on the screen for an insane series of hammer ons and suddenly you realize that you nailed them all....

That feeling you get when you get your first 100% on vocals on a particularly tough song.

That feeling you get when you get thre GGaHT for the first time on Hard on the drums....

That feeling is even better when you've got three other people jamming with you in your house or even online in quick band.

Seems like the expert level players who spend most of thier time trying to climb the leaderboards or upping thier "true skill" tend to forget that the majority of people who play this game aren't in the top 100 players. Obviously, with as many units sold, the REST of us play for different reasons.

EDIT: and I can play drums and guitar on expert.. but I don't care about leaderboards. Does this mean I have no life? No. It means I have fun playing and continue to challenge myself. Once I get completely through those careers I'll be practicing vocals till I can do that on expert as well. Simply because the game is fun for me. I could care less whether I'm in 1st place or 100,000,000th place.

Dino Ridiculous

12-24-2007, 01:42 PM

SSPWOLF

12-24-2007, 01:51 PM

I like the bass pedal. At first I was like everyone else and I was like "what the hell?" I couldn't get the timing right. Then the coolest thing happened. I was playing on Medium and the next thing I know, my foot is tapping to the beat and I didn't even realize it. That was one of the coolest things ever. My foot actually learned to be independent from my hands! Everyone has this ability unless they are physically handicapped. I now play expert and its all from practice. I understand everyone wants the no bass pedal cheat but if it's because it's too hard, then don't play drums. I'd rather see harmonix put the time and energy to create something more beneficial to the game then a no pedal cheat. Just my two cents............... :D

I've always said I was objective.

This is one argument I can actually sort of get behind.

I wouldn't care if they made the cheat... it wouldn't bother me one bit.

But if the choice was that they work on something else to ADD to the game or work on this cheat first.. I'd rather they come up with something new

:)

RastamanD

12-24-2007, 02:08 PM

umm is there a hyper-speed mode for guitar....sorry if this is semi-off topic

Nakor

12-24-2007, 04:35 PM

Wow this is ridiculous. I read through the first 8 and a half pages while waiting for my country's useless postal "service" to deliver my copy of the game, and I can't believe it's lasted for 10 pages. What are you debating? NattyLight is just your standard forum troll/flamer/griefer and who cares what he thinks? Additionally, a cheat can either be used or not used. If it doesn't allow posting of scores or the gaining of achievements, who the hell cares? Why not put it in there for the people that want it?

Ultrace

12-24-2007, 05:15 PM

Why not put it in there for the people that want it?
Because if not enough people want it... It's a waste of resources to put it in instead of doing something else more beneficial to the game.

Admiralwiggin

12-24-2007, 05:21 PM

what resources it already exists as seen in departments stores

espher

12-24-2007, 05:34 PM

Well, I'm still not a fan of making things easier for the sake of making things easier.

I don't think easy drums is particularly hard. I honestly think the game is set up perfectly to get you to progress from difficulty to difficulty without overloading you. It might not be as easy to jump in on as vocals or the guitar, but it's great scaling.

The easy charts aren't too complicated, and more often than not you're playing a simple pattern over and over the whole song.

One problem I've noticed with a lot of my friends (and again on Saturday night when we were playing again) is they don't seem to recognize the pattern for what it is and instead keep trying to sight read over and over and get all tangled up and frustrated. This is especially true if they jump on the drum kit and immediately pick an upper tier drum song because they 'love the drums on this song'.

For one guy I just counted out a one-two-three-four beat while he was playing and it got him into the habit of playing the pattern as a pattern and not just as the notes came to him. He improved a fair bit and he's now playing on medium.

Perhaps because the game is designed to encourage working your way up through the difficulty levels the easy charts aren't as pick up and play on the guitar or on vocals and may, God forbid, require some practice to get into a pattern, but if the pedal were gone altogether it makes the jump to medium that much harder.

Again, if they were to put in such a cheat, I wouldn't complain or demand it removed because I don't think I should dictate changes the designer needs to make to their game, but I think it's a bad idea from a gameplay standpoint because it makes the drums far too easy for my tastes and in a way inhibits advancement.

Honestly we should just remove scoring altogether so everyone can sit around drunk and play this game without having to actually play the game.

Allforce

12-26-2007, 10:02 PM

Wow ten pages on this since I first posted it.

Anyways, the point was more for MORE people to have fun with it that aren't A. Experienced drummers, B. Hardcore gamers, and C. Obsessed with leaderboards.

Sometimes you just want to have some drinks with your buddies and wail on the drums like Animal and feel like a rock star. And there's a definite line in all of these games like Guitar Hero and Rock Band where you go from feeling like you're playing a video game to feeling like you're playing a song . And that line is between easy and medium. So for alot of us it's just not fun to play on Easy, despite it being good "practice". It just feels like you're hitting random buttons and the sounds don't even go with it.

I just wanted to try out some of the songs on drums at the higher difficulty with my friends without having it just be an exercise in frustration trying to stay alive the whole song. And spare me the "practice more noob" talk because my friends and I are all in our thirties and just want to play the game and have fun with it when we can find time to get together.

Also, it's in the demo stations exactly as I've described it, with the CPU playing the kick drum for you. Obviously this can't be a completely different build of the game so why the hell not right?

Still haven't heard from anyone that works at Harmonix on this. Matt Moss sent me and said you guys would have all the answers!

Tokenicole

12-31-2007, 10:38 PM

You obviously don't have kids!
My 2 year old has perfect rythym and plays the drums, sings and plays her PS2 guitar while we play rockband. She doesn't care that it doesn't register as part of the game. But the 4 year old that can play the drums except they can't reach the pedal shouldn't be forced out of a game that was advertised as fun for the whole family and promoted without the pedal!! So those of us that went by advertising and in store promotions, and purchased the game with the notion that our kids would be able to play the drums only to be faced with an unreachable pedal!!! We know the code is out there because the promotions did not use a pedal....so release it already Harmonix, or those of us that bought this "family friendly" are stuck with GH3 because there are no peripherals that the kids should be able to use but oh sorry they added that pedal you can't reach so it's back to being an adults only game.....ridiculous!

snwns26

12-31-2007, 10:40 PM

There are no cheats other than Unlock All.

adamcole

01-06-2008, 06:32 AM

What's the point of playing drums if there's no bass pedal.:D

It's like the people that play Beatmania IIDX with the turntable turned off. I guess that just can't process all that info at once. :D

griffinmills

01-06-2008, 09:22 AM

If they hadn't sent out demo kits with this ability then I'd have a lot less sympathy for folks, but since it was something that existed just enable it as a cheat and do whatever "online scoring disabled" or blah blah you need to keep folks happy.

CS510

01-06-2008, 09:23 AM

forget an auto-bass cheat.
Kid too short to reach the pedal, you can adjust the drums for a person to be sitting, there's no possible way to be too short.
also on easy and most songs on medium you can ignore the bass and still pass.

The only gripe i have with the bass pedal is that there's only 1, when there should be two.

Doing beats and offbeats with 1 bass pedal gets ridiculous on hard/expert.
Harmonix really needs to start gearing up to be selling a splitter with a second bass pedal.

...although it really does put the drums on a pedestal being significantly harder than guitar/singing

davidshek

01-06-2008, 10:19 AM

Doing beats and offbeats with 1 bass pedal gets ridiculous on hard/expert.
Harmonix really needs to start gearing up to be selling a splitter with a second bass pedal.

So you admit right there that you're having trouble coordinating your one foot already for kick drum parts...do you really think it's going to be easier with two? No, it's going to be even harder to coordinate 4 limbs if you're already having trouble with 3! :rolleyes:

Nextonex

01-06-2008, 11:07 AM

I am trying to send a msg to JimJolly regarding his stepdaughter in the wheelchair trying to use the bass pedal. I try to view his public profile but I get access denied and I can't seem to figure out how to send him a PM without access to his public profile. If there is any way a mod or admin can help, please send me an email.

JimJolly, please contact me either in this thread or at nextonex@gmail.com

Dalamari

01-06-2008, 11:11 AM

I'd love autobass, mostly because my bass pedal is currently busted

frybrain

01-06-2008, 11:30 AM

If they even put this in, they should make it usable in practice mode only! That way they won't be tearing through the solo tour but can still take the base pedal off. And to all the people who want it off because it hurts your leg, I don't get near enough excercise as I should, and I've NEVER had a problem with my leg hurting. Not even on those songs on expert where you have to keep pressing it about twice a second.

LordJonas

01-06-2008, 11:57 AM

This game is all about timing. TIMING.

COUNT COUNT COUNT and you'll have no problem with learning songs.

Don't be lazy and skip practicing.

I can see how it'd be hard for people who don't play real insturments out there to suck on timing (especially if they just natrually lack rythm) but I can also see why they DON'T need a kick cheat.

If you can't play drums that well or learn them that well then just STOP. It's not your thing if you're gonna complain about it.

Sgt Pepper

01-06-2008, 12:28 PM

TheTFacta

01-06-2008, 12:57 PM

Drums really arn't drums if there's no bass pedal.

Practice up and you'll be fine.

JTBold

01-06-2008, 01:19 PM

there's an entire group of amazing drummers called "jazz players" many of which play without a hi-hat at all.

Wha...? Please name one professional jazz drummer that DOESNT use a hi-hat. It's ludicrous to suggest that there's even a small minority of jazzers that doen't use HH, let alone "many".

For those unfamiliar with the stylistic differences between rock and jazz drumming, in jazz it is the cymbals which are the primary sound, as opposed to rock where the primary sounds are bass drum plus snare drum. When I teach drumset and/or jazz ensembles, this is covered in the very first lesson. In jazz, ride cymbal is the primary timekeeping device, accompanied by hi-hat on beats 2 and 4. To suggest that "many" jazz drummers play without a hi-hat is like saying "many" rock drummers don't use a snare drum. It's utterly ridiculous.

xXTwilightXx

01-06-2008, 01:31 PM

first of all, why dont you just go into practice mode? You know...where you cant fail!? And Secondly why isn't the thread closed? Its a ******ed discussion

GrimmTrixX

01-07-2008, 02:13 AM

i think its a good idea, just disable achievements, you know? My girlfriend would totally play the drum part with me, but she just cant/hates doing the kick pedal, therefore she wont play it. I figured easy mode would have no kick pedal but for some reason thats not the case.

cpjusschillen

01-08-2008, 12:41 PM

HeXcoda

01-08-2008, 01:32 PM

its good just to have the option. its a family game, and my "older" relatives love it, but they suck at foot-hand-eye coordination.

It's a great idea for people who want to play but have unusable legs (paraplegics?)

Seconded on both.

My sis and her husband enjoy playing RB but the drums have been sitting in a corner unused because neither of them have the coordination to do it and aren't interested in spending hours getting the hang of it. We just wanna get together every few weeks and rock a bit.

Also, I'm physically disabled and while I can play the pads fine, I'm unable to use the pedal. I'm not paraplegic, I just don't have the specific joint motion in my legs needed.

I feel kinda like I was taken for a ride on my 170 dollar kit given I can't play the drums and nobody who plays locally with me can play the drums and I already had a compatible guitar and mike I could've used with the 60 dollar game...

Tokenicole

01-25-2008, 03:57 PM

Thank you for the reasonable reply! This was supposed to be a family game and i bought it based on the previews that had no mention of a kick pedal (also thought the GH3 guitar would work but that's another gripe) I think all the narcissists that play only to be on the boards should get off the thread! I wanna be able to play with the whole family and since only the adults can master the dual hand eye coordination of the drums and the mic doesn't have a headset so that the drummer or guitar player can also sing, our Rockband sits in a corner and will likely end up being resold. I'd hoped that Harmonix might've taken more of an interest in this thread because they will lose a core group that the Guitar Hero Franchise got interested in gaming... women...we don't care about the high score boards, would prefer a wired guitar so we don't have to keep changing batteries and bought the game for xmas so the whole family could play. Only then did we discover that the kids couldn't actually use ANY of the instruments and getting through easy on multiplayer required playing weezer over and over and over until there was no one left who was even interested in watching! Thanks for the bright idea but what an incredibly bad rollout.

RockBand.com