Flams

[parastroke7]

This concerns the drumming portion of the game.

A flam is when one stick hits directly after another. You can hear drummers doing this in certain songs. If I'm not mistaken, the song "Vasoline" by STP has a number of flams in it. I was just wondering if there may be flams in Expert mode. I would imagine not, but it'd make it a lot more authentic, and challenging.

Why not other rudimental strokes? Well, not too many of the other strokes can't be played with single strokes. In real life, accenting would matter, but this game can't pick up on accenting so I don't think it will matter.

A stupid question about flams, but just one of many stupid questions.

[cezar515]

Yeah, Tom Sawyer and Go With The Flow also have flams in them. It could be just like a flam if they have two notes of the same drum really close together I guess though.

[Jimmik]

Hopefully they'll put them in the game. I'm actually kind of concerned how they'll display them on the note track, though. I assume they'll just do two notes closely, but I was hoping they'd put a connecting line between them, or maybe make it kind of an "8" shape, where the two notes really are connected, to show you're gonna be doing a flam. The same concern came up when I thought about rolls. You'd have to do a lot of quick counting if the notes were all just lumped together when you do, say, a 16 note roll. Maybe a small countdown of notes to go in a roll section? Something like that would be coo.

[parastroke7]

Hopefully they'll put them in the game. I'm actually kind of concerned how they'll display them on the note track, though. I assume they'll just do two notes closely, but I was hoping they'd put a connecting line between them, or maybe make it kind of an "8" shape, where the two notes really are connected, to show you're gonna be doing a flam. The same concern came up when I thought about rolls. You'd have to do a lot of quick counting if the notes were all just lumped together when you do, say, a 16 note roll. Maybe a small countdown of notes to go in a roll section? Something like that would be coo.


I'm very glad you can empathise with that. I'd really like to see them in the game. With the way they show hammer-ons, they could easily adapt that same idea and use it for flams. A solid note, and then a hammer-on style note connected to it to display a flam. Watch, just like how GH has the "hammer ons" tutorial, RB will have the "flams" tutorial.

[Spandrel]

What would a flam look like? An HO/PO relies on different notes on the fret board, but a flam would be two very closely spaced notes on the snare. I guess they could do it, but the timing of a flam in the game could be tricky, especially for drumming novices.

[parastroke7]

What would a flam look like? An HO/PO relies on different notes on the fret board, but a flam would be two very closely spaced notes on the snare. I guess they could do it, but the timing of a flam in the game could be tricky, especially for drumming novices.

I would feel somewhat bad for a drumming novice for not being able to play some flam patterns, but the difficulty of "Expert" should be earned rather than given, I think.

and as Jimmik said, they could just make it an '8' shape to represent a flam. This eliminates the problem of relying on different notes to make it like a hammer-on.

[Dabog666]

I also agree with JimmiK, as it would be difficult to see how many notes are in a roll. Perhaps they will just have a long bar and the number of strokes written beside it, OR maybe they'll have every roll as a free form fill, to eliminate the problem. That does seem unlikely though. As for the flams, I'd say that it will be represented as one note; the '8' that was talked about. In easy or medium modes I thing they will be single notes too

[JarethLegend]

I think this all depends on the scrolling speed. I've played other games of this nature, that I don't know if I'm allowed to list, but flams and rolls are just shown as normal and I have no problem seeing and playing them. I don't think any special notation is necessary as long as you can choose a scroll speed to help differentiate things. I also don't feel that the difficulty of performing and differentiating a flam should mean it should not be in the game. That's what higher difficulties are for. If you can't do it then play on a lower difficulty level. I for one can and want to.

[Drummerskillz]

I actually hope there is technical drumming in there because its a thrill to perform the technincal side of drumming. :)

[JarethLegend]

It's good to know I'm not the only person who actually wants this game to be technical and difficult at least at the highest level. I had to register because I got tired of reading all these non-drummers and amateur drummers talking about how this is just a game and that technical drumming won't be fun. Again that is what difficulty levels are for. Obviously those people should not be able to play on the highest level, but for me I will be playing at that level from the start and I will have tons of fun. Without the technical aspects I would not have fun. I want to be able to play a game with my friends who aren't as musically inclined as myself, but also do not want to be bored to death. It would also be nice if I could even actually get a bit of practice from this game on songs I'd want to play outside of just this game on my real sets.

[parastroke7]

It's good to know I'm not the only person who actually wants this game to be technical and difficult at least at the highest level. I had to register because I got tired of reading all these non-drummers and amateur drummers talking about how this is just a game and that technical drumming won't be fun. Again that is what difficulty levels are for. Obviously those people should not be able to play on the highest level, but for me I will be playing at that level from the start and I will have tons of fun. Without the technical aspects I would not have fun. I want to be able to play a game with my friends who aren't as musically inclined as myself, but also do not want to be bored to death. It would also be nice if I could even actually get a bit of practice from this game on songs I'd want to play outside of just this game on my real sets.

If there were a proverbial nail, you'd be the proverbial hammer, beating it on the head with every swing you take. Not to resort to redundancy, but you hit the nail on the head. Higher difficulties ARE for the more experienced. Lower difficulties are for the less experienced. If a person is whining because expert mode is too hard, then they are not on the correct difficulty to match their skill. The word "expert" ( if that's the word they use ) carries a lot of weight. So, a true "expert" should be the one playing on expert.

and I feel you about playing with friends. Either you're the one that's bored to tears, or they're the ones that are bored to tears. Being able to truly choose a difficulty that matches your skill level will make it fun for those who are actually skilled musicians in real life. Also, the lesser difficulties for make it fun for people who could carry ten tons LONG before they'd gain the capability to carry a rythm.

You need to post a lot more, because you've got a way with words. Make some threads.

[JarethLegend]

If there were a proverbial nail, you'd be the proverbial hammer, beating it on the head with every swing you take. Not to resort to redundancy, but you hit the nail on the head. Higher difficulties ARE for the more experienced. Lower difficulties are for the less experienced. If a person is whining because expert mode is too hard, then they are not on the correct difficulty to match their skill. The word "expert" ( if that's the word they use ) carries a lot of weight. So, a true "expert" should be the one playing on expert.

and I feel you about playing with friends. Either you're the one that's bored to tears, or they're the ones that are bored to tears. Being able to truly choose a difficulty that matches your skill level will make it fun for those who are actually skilled musicians in real life. Also, the lesser difficulties for make it fun for people who could carry ten tons LONG before they'd gain the capability to carry a rythm.

You need to post a lot more, because you've got a way with words. Make some threads.

Thank you very much. I'm not much of a forum sort of person nor a writer, but ever since a certain other game came out a long time before this; I've been waiting for a game in the same vein, but made as one package with all instruments to be released in the US. My main instrument has always been drums and I enjoy high level play when it comes to everything. I'm a big fan of professional gaming as well and like to compete as often as I can. When I heard about a new drumming based game that includes guitar, bass, and vocals, I became extremely excited as I've been playing a few other games for years, but now my friends can enjoy a rhythm game with me as well.

So I began to read the forums to see how the game was coming along and noticed some things that I feel would ruin the game at least for me and those like me. I felt like my side of things hasn’t been represented in the forums and decided to post. I really want to have an amazing experience with this game and so I figure this is the time to put out my feelings and see whether others feel the same way too. Hopefully there are people out there who would like a level of play at least for the drums that is as close to the real thing as possible. If not then there goes all my hopes and dreams. Ok, so that's being a tad melodramatic, but I am extremely excited about how amazing this game could turn out to be even for someone like me who is a real musician.

I’ll be sticking around for a while at least to bring up other points of view when I feel a certain segment of their consumer base is not being spoken for or otherwise, if everything goes well, then I’ll simply have a lot of praise to write out in these forums.

[Dabog666]

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to be really play technically in RB on harder difficulties, as I would be able to, being a drummer.
I also agree with whoever commented about it all depending on the scroll speed.

[tf5_bassist]

flams, rolls, paradiddles (haha i love that word), and other technical-type drumming techniques could very easily be part of expert level (and some key moments of medium/hard as well--remember the completely random orange note in whatever medium song on GH2? hah! yeah, i forgot which one it was).

I like the concept of an alternate display for such close notes. Even though I'm a bassist and guitarist primarily, I've always loved drums as well, and flams--especially "power flams" as I call them (kick-snare-snare or kick-floor tom-snare type patterns)--are one of my little drumming loves. If they "dumb down" certain key passages even on expert, it'll be tough to not play it that way if I'm used to it (as it took me a long time to learn the bass track to "John The Fisherman" as it's not entirely representative of the real bass part lol).

Let's hope these are in there, although I really don't see how it "couldn't" be done. :D

edit: I'm still awaiting that first double-bass pedal mod! I know someone will do it!

[Dabog666]

I think in one of the more recent RB videos, the flams showed up as two notes beside one another, to be hit at the exact same time.

[PinkFloyd]

just for the total drum-n00bs amongst us (including me). What the hell is a flam?

[Dabog666]

just for the total drum-n00bs amongst us (including me). What the hell is a flam?

A flam is when you hit a drum twice in very quick succession, almost creating the sound of one 'broad' note.

Hope this helps :D

[PinkFloyd]

A flam is when you hit a drum twice in very quick succession, almost creating the sound of one 'broad' note.

Hope this helps :D

could you give an example, I got all the QOTSA CDs here, I saw them come by in the topic.

[Dabog666]

On the album 'songs for the deaf', there's a track called song for the dead.
Listen to the drum intro at the start, from about 27 seconds to 35 seconds in. When he hits the snare drum (or 'side' drum) during this section, if you listen very carefully, you'll notice that he hits it twice, quickly, as opposed to once, during the rest of the song.

I'm sorry if this is kinda vague, but it's hard to convey the sound via text:D

[PinkFloyd]

On the album 'songs for the deaf', there's a track called song for the dead.
Listen to the drum intro at the start, from about 27 seconds to 35 seconds in. When he hits the snare drum (or 'side' drum) during this section, if you listen very carefully, you'll notice that he hits it twice, quickly, as opposed to once, during the rest of the song.

I'm sorry if this is kinda vague, but it's hard to convey the sound via text:D

Ah, I hear it now, yeh that WOULD be cool to do in RB :D

Thx!

[AVC808]

this is the best way i can explain it. imagine swinging your arms side to side holding drum sticks. as they swoop down to hit the drum, they wont hit the drum simultaneously, but in quick succession.

[Dabog666]

Ah, I hear it now, yeh that WOULD be cool to do in RB :D

Thx!

No problem man

[tf5_bassist]

Everything you could want to know about flams, but were too afraid to youtube search for (http://youtube.com/results?search_query=flam&search=Search)

and some other, quite random sh*t. :D

[Dabog666]

Go to the first video from tf5_bassist's link. lol, flam paradiddle sounds like a messed up cartoon charater.

[miketoast]

I just flammed my funny bone on my desk, damnit that hurts like ****ing hell!!!