Please put Nine Inch Nails in RB

[decoyoct]

I'm a big NIN fan, so I know my opinion is slightly biased, but please hear me out. First, I'll debunk reasons why they shouldn't be in RB, then I'll give reasons why they should.

1. The lyrics may be too mature for the audience. There is an easy way to fix this. It's already known that RB will be coming out for the PS3, XB360, and possibly the Wii. All three of these systems have downloadable content. If there's a worry about parents not buying the game because of an ESRB rating of "Suggestive lyrics", then make the available NIN track(s) downloadable only. This way, the parents still have a say in what their child is listening to.

Also, most likely, it'll be a song from Year Zero to promote the album. The two singles from Year Zero are Survivalism and Capital G. Capital G may be too inappropriate (motherf***s, sh**), but the only suggestive lyric Survivalism has is "can't seem to shut her legs our mother nature is a whore". The overall tone itself may be a little too harsh as well, but if people didn't want to listen/sing/play it, they wouldn't download it.

2.NIN wouldn't fit the theme of the game. Amplitude had Slipknot, Frequency had Roni Size, Karaoke Revolution had Nickelback and KISS. One or two songs don't break a game's theme. It's not like RB is going to have nothing but 80's hair bands.

3.It's too late to add anyone. Maybe for going gold, but not for a download. Also, the multi-track files for Capital G and Survivalism are already available at http://yearzero.nin.com/ so it's possible to work on an internal version before getting the official OK.

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1.Trent is a gamer. Trent has made songs for Quake, sounds for Doom 3, and has been spotted in multiple game stores (and is even rumored to play Guitar Hero). In the Year Zero credits, he thanks Activison, Nintendo of America, and SCEA. Getting his permission shouldn't be a problem, but I don't know how lenient Interscope is.

2.NIN has a huge fan base. If you're worried about losing a couple of customers because of NIN, you'll get plenty more by putting them in. It's already been said that RB may be the most expensive console game of all time, so the sales will defiantly be needed. Just check out the activity on one of the main free NIN message boards, http://www.echoingthesound.org/phpbbx/ . Also, there's the official NIN message board that people actually pay to post on http://www.nin-thespiral.com/ .

3.The potential to bring in even non-NIN fans with the Year Zero ARG. For those of you who don't know, there is a huge ARG (Alternate Reality Game) based on the new NIN album, Year Zero. For a full list of what's happened so far, go to http://www.ninwiki.com . The ARG is currently on pause, but it's said that it will go on for about a year and a half. Since RB is scheduled for this holiday season, it should still be going on. The ARG has brought in many people, even those who don't really like NIN. In by putting a single piece of the puzzle into RB somehow (it could be just a simple number somewhere, something very minute and only noticeable to people looking for it) you'll guarantee a few sales from that.

[benjamin]

You have a throughly written out post which clearly explains your ideas.

So just to be a dick I am going to say No and Wrong Section.

[spokkeh]

I love NIN. Yes, put them in :D

[sa_nick]

I'm a huge NIN fan too, it'd be awesome if some of their stuff made it in. However not just any NIN song would fit, 95% of them wouldnt be fun to play in Rock Band. However some songs would be damn fun to play.

Kinda I Want To - Pretty Hate Machine

Last - Broken

March of the Pigs - The Downward Spiral

No, You Don't - The Fragile

Getting Smaller - With Teeth

Meet Your Master - Year Zero

I reckon they would be the top songs for Rock Band from each album (not my fav song, just the ones i think would work best)

But still, all those songs would only be good in multiplayer mode. Besides drums and sometimes bass theres never constant enough vocals and guitar throughout the songs making it extremely boring for single player mode.

P.S. still pissed that the 2 NIN shows i had tickets to in Sydney got cancelled... goin back in september though:D

[decoyoct]

Well, there's optimal solutions, and then there's realistic ones. I would love to have Mr. Self Destruct (for the drums), Wish (for the vocals), and The Perfect Drug (for the guitar) in RB. But I'm not making a wish list here, I'm just trying to get NIN in, so I'm trying to find a way all three groups can be satisfied here (NIN, HMX, and the players). NIN would want to promote themselves and not ruin their image, HMX would want to sell as many copies as possible while keeping a good report with the fans with minimal overhead, and the players would want something fun to play that wouldn't break their arms, fingers, or vocal chords.

Also, the problem with getting most NIN songs (and songs in general) into RB is the use of the piano/keyboard. There is none in RB! They would have to be simulated with another instrument, or done on the click track (or whatever they call the track that plays in the background). That's boring. The good thing about Survivalism and Capital G is that there's a good "spread" with the RB instruments, so no individual musician(?) would be bored. The horns in Capital G could be a problem though.

Some NIN songs would be just... weird. The baby crying part in "No, you don't" for example. I can just picture it. "Yeah man, I'm totally rocking out to this song, check this out! WAAAAAAAHHHH! WAAAAAHHHHH!" I would love the last song for the drummer's solo-play (if it even works that way) to be The Perfect Drug though. Oh man, that would be INTENSE.

[FoKFill]

/signed.

NIN in RB would rock so hard!

[c0nd0rd4myt]

im pretty sure the Setlist Forum would be a better place for this. NiN is a great band, but i think theyd need to be picky about what song they put in.

[decoyoct]

I see the Set List forum as more of a music discussion forum than a game forum, that's why I posted it here. If I had a list of songs I wanted to suggest, then maybe there, but since it's only two (technically only one, Survivalism) I really think this forum fits better.

I can understand the need to be picky, but let's think about what would eliminate/qualify a song.

1. Does the song rock?
2. Do people want to hear it?
3. Can the rights to the song be obtained?
4. Would it be fun to play?

I think Survivalism fits this bill perfectly, but not to limit ourselves here, there's plenty of other NIN songs that also fit the bill, so this is more of a blanket request.

[c0nd0rd4myt]

there is more to be considered about the song than just those 4 things.

1. would the ESRB/FCC/National Parenting Association/NAACP/any other socio-political organization get angst for a song being put in?
2. edits. if you need to take out lyrics or whatever from a song, does it completly take away from the feel?
3. difficulty. can it be scaled from easy to insane relativly easily?
4. Balance. does it give something for everyone? as a drummer i wouldnt like waiting two minutes for my chance to play

and going back to your original points...
a. trent is a gamer...i feel to see how this is relavent to anything. Paris Hilton is a gamer to some extent, yet i dont think we should be adding songs from her singing album (yah she actually did have a singing album).
b. sales #'s. i honestly dont think that the setlist would change dramatically by the inclusion or removal of any one particular song or band. as long as the setlist as a whole Rocks consistantly, the players will buy it and enjoy it. I personally am rooting for some miracle that a Hammerfall song gets snuck into the setlist, and even though i know it wont happen, i'm going to buy my guitarset and a copy of the game when it releases anyway.
c. i have no clue what an Alternative Reality game is, but i dont think that doing something for it for kicks would also not really "gurantee" any more sales. it would be great for people who are into the ARG and would pickup the game anyway, but everyone else would just hit up the internet or a friend for the hint (or whatever it is your talkin bout).
d. downloadable content. you make it sound like because its downloadable that would somehow make it not-offensive. may i remind you of Hot Coffee dear sir, and that people had to 1 buy the game for thier innocent children and 2 find a hack for it. regardless of the fact that the game was not intended for these younglings, they still found fault with those who made the game, what makes you think that wont happen with DC either?

[decoyoct]

1. Since it'll be downloadable, the ESRB would put "experience may change during online play" or whatever that warning is, and they're in the clear.
2. That's why I suggested Survivalism, with only one lyric that MAY be offensive. Even then, Trent hasn't had a problem with editing songs to be public-friendly before. Starsuckers, and using the word "thorns" in the Johnny Cash version of Hurt was Trent's idea.
3. Any song can be made easy, just look at Jordan. The problem would be making an "easy" song hard, and I believe NIN is complex enough to be fun and challenging, depending on the song they pick/get.
4. Just listen to the multi-track files. There's plenty for everyone. Also, you're going to get that in just about any song.


A. Since Trent is a gamer, getting the rights to a NIN song will be easier. Also, Trent makes GOOD songs.
B. Dramatically? No, but it will change. As a whole, yes, if the game rocks people will buy it, but let's just take a look here. Look at how many fans sign up for The Spiral, how many are on EchoingTheSound. Trent's even been named one of the top 25 most influential people by Time magazine. You cannot deny NIN's popularity.
C. There are many different levels of being "into" anything, be it an ARG or a video game. This is best desribed by the people running the ARG, 42 entertainment http://www.42entertainment.com/see.html . A good exampel of this would be Rock Band itself. Do you think everyone who signs up for this website are the only people that are buying this game?
D. May I remind you that Hot Coffee was not official, and that "Nude Raider" patches have been out WAY before that. It's not like you can connect to some PS2 online network and download the Hot Coffee patch. Hot Coffee was still unlocked by modification, it didn't matter that the developers made it or not. That was just an example of the ESRB making a huge mistake, but the bigger mistake was by RockStar saying that they didn't make it. If RockStar fessed up and actually made a good argument, I think that GTA:SA would still have kept it's MA rating. While we're on the subject, Oblivion was bumped up to MA not only because of the "nude patch" (which wasn't even possible on the 360 version, but they gave it an MA anyway), but because of graphic content during one of the Dark Brotherhood quests that wasn't released to the ESRB beforehand. This is completely different anyway, since people bought GTA:SA not knowing that there was the Hot Coffee content. If NIN was in RB, it would be there, but with a choice. If someone buys a gun and shoots someone, you don't sue the gun manufacturers. If a parent buys a game for a kid, and that kid still needs this level of supervision, then this parent should buy the NIN song. Simple as that. Granted, the kid could buy it on their own, but it's still the responsibility of the parent to see what content the kid is having access to, so the parent is still responsible for their child's actions.

DC? You mean RB?

If you're saying that one song won't make or break RB anyway, then why argue against it?

[c0nd0rd4myt]

not exactly arguing against it, its just that the reason that youve been listing apply for just about any somewhat succesful band out there. the Insane Clown Posse has a tabletop RPG game very similar to D&D that was illustrated and written my Todd McFarlane (the same guy who did Spawn), so they could throw a little tidbit in there as well for any Juggalos out there.

points1 and D together. your missing what i'm getting at. it doesnt matter wether its really bad or not, or whose fault it really is. "concerned" parents and activists will place blame at whoever they believe its easiest. and to some extent yah it does matter, but thats for another day. my point overall is, the less heat overall the better. and your also helping illustrate my other point. parents dont take responsibility. if parents didnt notice that big fat M rating on San Andreas, what makes you think their gonna notice the "experience may change in online play" sign on the package when they find thier kid playing songs from the album Antichrist Superstar.

2,3,4: these points are also true. what i said was more down the lines of all bands and songs. like one of my favorite songs "dark wings, dark messenger" the drummer doesnt get any action for the first two minutes.

A: that has nothing to do with it considering trent doesnt own the rights to his own songs (or at least i dont think he does). they would have to talk to whoever technically OWNS his music, just like any other band.
B: perhaps, but i really dont think most people. would buy a game (plus an 60 dollar periphreal) for one song. its not like consoles where one game justifies dropping the money for a console (i.e. Halo, Gears of War, Final Fantasy, Legend of Zelda). in GH and RB you have to play other songs to reach that song, and i would imagine for NiN it would be one of the more difficult levels.
C: also, there is some truth to that, but consider this. how many people do you know that would be willing to drop 100 dollars or more on a game that helps play another game? would it be nice for them to add a little something for the ARG fans? sure it would, just like if they added the Templar character from Hammerfall who appears on all thier albums as playable (or just as an NPC). however, neither things would be "on the box", meaning a major selling point.

and by DC i meant Downloadable Content.

[decoyoct]

The ICP table top game was put OUT by ICP, so I don't see how that counts.

We're talking about conceptual responsibility compared to actual here. No amount of... anything can stop bad parenting and lack of responsibility. No matter what you do, no matter how much you fix it, someone somewhere will complain about it and not claim responsibility for their own actions. On the other hand, from a legal standpoint, all they need is a slight warning, which the ESRB already provides, and they're covered. It's not like it's Marylin Manson or Ozzy Osbourne... oh wait, Ozzy already made it into GH!

A. Okay, so we don't know if Trent does own the rights so-to-say, but we can see what's happening to the songs with whoever DOES own the rights. With Year Zero, the moment it was leaked online, it was available to listen to for free on nin.com. Four songs have been released, for free, with their multitrack files, with plans to release the rest of the album in the same manner. The whole album is STILL available to listen to, for free, at NIN's MySpace. Someone ok-ed all of these, and they were all free to the public. Why would they say no to doing something similar AND getting a cut of the profit?

B. It's not like people are going to go "Rock Band? PFF! I'll never play that ever!... Oh wait, it has NIN?! OF COURSE I'LL SHELL OUT MONEY FOR IT!". The more expensive a game (or anything) is, the more people are going to be on the fence about buying it. Putting NIN in will defiantly tip some people over to the "buy it" side. Plus, if it was downloadable, it wouldn't be a "locked" song, so you wouldn't have to do anything to get to it, other than pay for the song. When people glance over the song-list, they're going to see who they know. NIN is popular, it's an eye catching name. From a sales point of view, it's an excellent decision.

C. I'm not saying it's a "major selling point", just an incentive. None of this would be a "major selling point", but it would be stupid to say that adding NIN wouldn't affect sales. If you want to go for a non-"On the box" selling point, I have the perfect example for you already: Slipknot on Amplitude. Slipknot was huge at the time of Amplitude, yet it was no where on the box art. Same exact principle applies here, but there's even a higher level of "protection" here with downloadable content.

[c0nd0rd4myt]

the reason why they have done that and made an entire album availbale like that is to get thier name out, and to advertise. alot of people (myself included) are hesitant when we buy music, and wont buy an album for one song we like. NiN (or thier owners) realised that and put more of the songs out there, thereby allowing people to make a better judgement call. the way they get away with it is that you have you to be on your computer and on thier website as well in order to listen.

B. yes this is true to a certain extent, but this isnt exactly something thats unique to NiN. that same scenario would be true with any band.

C. yah, slipknot in amplitude was a nice little thing to put in there, but i dont think it was so much a selling point as it was a little something extra for those who allready bought it.

[hmxsean]

My personal belief is that if a parent were likely to sue over some imagined crime that listening and interacting with rock music could (in their own minds) cause then I think they would probably be unlikely to let their kids play the game in the first place. That said- one of my favorite memories as a kid was driving around with my uncle listening to Black Sabbath, so apparently being exposed to rock at a young age is kind of crazy. :)

[decoyoct]

B. Yes, with any one band, if any one person saw their favorite band on something, they're more likely to buy it. Logically, the more popular the band, the more likely this is going to happen. NIN is huge, therefore, it's more likely to happen.

This conversation I feel has gone too destruction than constructive. I've made my points, and since a member of HMX replied in it, I know it's been seen.


I really wasn't exposed to that much rock at an early age. My parents were very protective of what I could listen to and do. I could make a HUGE list, but I'll just give you this little tidbit: I wasn't allowed to listen to Weird Al because he did "Like a surgeon" and my parents didn't want me knowing the definition of virgin. Banned by proxy :( I listened mostly to The Beatles and Christian music growing up. There's some actually good Christian songs out there, surprisingly. Not many, but some.

[c0nd0rd4myt]

i dont mean to be destructive or nasty or whatever, though it often comes off that way and trust me i do try to work on it.

i understand your points as well and your bill for NiN is a piece of personal preference. and thats okay. personally i would other bands, but ey whatever floats your boat.

[sa_nick]

The more I listen to 'Last' the more I can image it being in Rock Band. Serisouly, everyone go listen to Last off NIN album Broken. It's a lot... rockier and.... consistant? than other NIN songs.

[Fios_1]

NIN would be great for rock band.

[decoyoct]

Last would be great, but it might be a little too harsh. It definitively rocks though: It has great and constant guitar and drum parts, and I would love to play it in RB.

[DShizzle1029]

I am one of the biggest dorks for NIN...

To fit this game though, they will probably have The Hand That Feeds if they do throw in NIN...I mean it fits the instruments perfectly besides a keyboard...and its not a suggestive song really, no curse words...

[decoyoct]

I am one of the biggest dorks for NIN...

To fit this game though, they will probably have The Hand That Feeds if they do throw in NIN...I mean it fits the instruments perfectly besides a keyboard...and its not a suggestive song really, no curse words...
I would just like to remind you that The Hand That Feeds was going to be played at the MTV music awards but was denied (for wanting to play in front of an unaltered image of George W. Bush), and that HMX is now owned by MTV.

[warcry]

NIN deserves to be in as much as any band out there, and for me personally, i would love to see it. i know alot of you will take this game mad serious, but probably even more will play it for the fun factor....i and alot of my friends will play this (probably drunk) in groups of 10+ people, and want to play songs we know and are fun. we all have different taste, but most if not all like NIN. so regardless of the difficulty, or breaks you take, or yata yata yata, it'll be fun to play NIN cause we like them, and they are popular (meaning alot would agree with me).

this game really seems like a party game, much in the same way that the Wii is a party console. guitar hero, karaoke in general is for the most part just fun...and this game combines those for an even better experience, i'm sold already just on the 4 songs i've seen announced already. so, if my favorite songs aren't in the main part, i'll be happy to get them in downloads....NIN should be there (for download if not in the original list):cool:

[naboob]

i agree. i would to see NIN in RB.