Not Looking Good For Microsoft Wireless, GH3 Compatibility

[Electric_Zen]

Interesting interview here:

http://www.gamespot.com/xbox360/puzzle/rockband/news.html?sid=6176613



[Microsoft] came up with a proprietary wireless solution which is actually from a technology perspective a fantastic solution. It actually works beautifully--almost no lag, it works very, very well. I believe originally they may not have had plans to license it out, and when we approached them, they viewed it [the Guitar Hero controller] as a whole different animal because it doesn't compete with the other wireless controllers that Microsoft itself makes. But I think early on they knew there would be some challenges, and a lot of support involved. So from a Microsoft standpoint they really had to believe in the title and that the title was going to make a difference for them to support peripheral development with the technical resources it was going to take. From the beginning we had been working very closely with Microsoft. They have sent engineers to our offices, and flown engineers to China to help us with getting the entire production set up. We've been working with people from all over the world from Denmark to Redmond on this project, so it was fairly extensive from an engineering point of view to get this into production.

It sounds like Microsoft has made it a complete b1tch and a half to build a wireless guitar, even for an accomplished peripheral maker like Red Octane. We have received continuous updates from Activision on their wireless guitar peripheral over the last few months, and no such info from Harmonix.

I do not believe that Microsoft will be seeing a Rock Band wireless guitar in 2007.

What about supporting Rock Band with the GH3 wireless guitars? Here's what he has to say:



That's exactly one of the points--it has always been one of the barriers of entry for people to get into the music rhythm games, and traditionally videogame companies in Europe, North America, and Australia do not cross the line of hardware and software. You mostly get videogame publishers who do only software, and hardware companies like Logitech who do only hardware. Very few companies are able to bridge the two... We did it with Guitar Hero and there was a tremendous challenge. To us it's always been a competitive advantage that we could do both. We obviously believe it's a competitive advantage, and even if they can make it work with our previous guitars, and they're able to piggyback on the install base we've created, we'll be able to continue to innovate, continue to build new features into both the hardware and the software and I think that Guitar Hero III and beyond to Guitar Hero IV will see the fruits of some of our experience being able to innovate begin to take shape.

This does not sound like a company that want to build support for Rock Band into their guitars.

[Bakkster_Man]

I saw that too. Honestly, I think it's a mistake for them to segregate GH3 and RB peripherals. If they aren't cross-compatible, I probably won't be buying GH3. If one of them works for the other, I'll probably get both and 2 guitars which are compatible with both.

Seems like Activision will shoot itself in the foot in the name of maintaining a "competitive advantage". Not that I won't play GH3, but it's not worth it to me to buy both if I need separate hardware for each.

[Ghaleon]

Really, did anyone expect Red Octane, a company that has traditionally made it's money manufacturing tiny toy instruments/dance pads, to not do everything in their power to keep people from using 3rd party devices? The dashboard update on the 360 would hint that they've done something beyond using the standard controller inputs wirelessly to insure that their controller is incompatible with Rock Band.

Depending on the implementation, it might be possible for the opposite to work (assuming there is a wireless Strat at all on the 360) if standard button mappings are used, making it look like a regular controller. Then again, I wouldn't be surprised if the MS wireless protocol involved some sort of identifier as to what type of controller it is (standard, wheel, guitar) which would make it easy enough for GH3 to reject input from in software.

Then again, I'm known to view things on the realisti..err negative side.

[Knockout_King]

It seems like RedOctane thinks that consumers would get RockBand if they already have the GH3 guitar that works. Au contraire, mon ami. I will probably not be buying GH3 if the guitar doesn't work for RB. Sorry, but GH is on the backburner now.

[Magnet]

we'll be able to continue to innovate, continue to build new features into both the hardware and the software

Damn it. I just know this means that with GH4 they're going to do something with the guitar to make sure the games (GH and RB) will no longer share the same peripheral abilities. Like someone suggested a bit ago, maybe a sixth fret button isn't as far off as we think. The features on the Rock Band's Strat that innovate are things that don't break compatibility with the GH games.

Yet in the Guitar Hero department, it sounds like they're seriously considering intentionally breaking compatibility with old GH games when they create GH4 to ensure a competitive hardware edge. And when you think about it, they kind of have to do it if they want their hardware to sell. What more can RedOctane really do with their peripherals after the GH3 guitars? Wireless? Done already. Ergonomic improvements? Done already (and even if the GH3's guitar ergonomic improvements aren't the best - who's going to spend $50 on a new guitar for GH4 solely for slight ergonomic improvements?).

I honestly don't see new guitar models for GH4 being enough of an enticement for spending $50 when you already have a controller that should work perfectly. I'm predicting GH4 sees some serious gameplay changes that will break compatibility. I hope I'm wrong, but Huang's comments point to this.

[Maherj]

This isn't shocking to me, and I'm sure that Red Octane is trying to be the exclusive wireless guitar controller for the 360, and want to not help out HMX. They are afraid, with reason, of what Rock Band is trying to accomplish, and you can tell as he is throwing a 280$ price tag out there to discourage it. Funny that the article also mentions people don't want to pay that for a casual game, yet charge 100 itself for it's own, and doesn't mention that you don't need to buy everything. These types of interviews make Rock Band look bad, and I hope that HMX puts out some sort of rebuttal.

[Ghaleon]

This isn't shocking to me, and I'm sure that Red Octane is trying to be the exclusive wireless guitar controller for the 360, and want to not help out HMX. They are afraid, with reason, of what Rock Band is trying to accomplish, and you can tell as he is throwing a 280$ price tag out there to discourage it. Funny that the article also mentions people don't want to pay that for a casual game, yet charge 100 itself for it's own, and doesn't mention that you don't need to buy everything. These types of interviews make Rock Band look bad, and I hope that HMX puts out some sort of rebuttal.

Indeed, he certainly enjoyed tossing speculative numbers around. Odd how he didn't mention the $160 or $170 for GH3 if you want the comprable "complete package". Nor was the fact that the numbers he spouted off for Rock Band were for 3 or 4 players as opposed to the single player experience of GH3 he was comparing against.

[Magnet]

and you can tell as he is throwing a 280$ price tag out there to discourage it.

Yeah, I found that part especially interesting. Here's his response for people that aren't going to go to the link to read the whole interview:


Rock Band has been getting a lot of attention, I think there are a couple of things that are interesting about it in the marketplace. For one, it's always kind of irked me personally the association with EA. Everyone likes to call it EA's Rock Band, but it doesn't make any sense to me because it's a game that's developed by Harmonix, and published by MTV, and distributed by EA. So as far as I can tell, their biggest contribution to it really is just shipping these 20 pound boxes. They're not developing, they're not publishing, so they don't have any of those rights, so calling it an EA title I've always felt was kind of misleading. In North America, the most famous title distributed through EA partners was Final Fantasy, and you wouldn't call Final Fantasy an EA title. Everyone assumes it's us against EA, but in my estimation it's misleading.

They are setting some very interesting precedents [with Rock Band]. I think the biggest thing for me is this price of $200 we hearing floating around for the ensemble. That's with a wired guitar and if you want a wireless guitar, the price floating around is another $80 dollars on top of that. If they went above $200, and possibly to $280, at $280 you're approaching the price of the Wii console, at least in North America. Those kinds of price points will be very, very interesting to watch. If the PS3 launch proved anything it's that in my opinion price does matter to videogame consumers. It'll be interesting to see how much consumer acceptance it has, especially for something billed as a casual game which will be $300 US dollars, or $280, seems to be awfully high for a casual game, but we'll see. As far as in your territory, Australia and New Zealand, I have two predictions: one is, I don't think it will actually ship this Christmas in Australia/New Zealand, and secondly I think if it does, the retail price of that will be at least probably A$275 and it'll be very interesting to see. We worked with Harmonix for years and they've always done a terrific job helping videogames--there's no reason to expect they wouldn't--but I think you're getting into unchartered territory. This is probably the most expensive videogame of all time, and for a casual game, it'll be interesting to see how well that gets carried off.

$280 total? As if the game wouldn't work correctly with the packaged wired guitar in the first place? I don't want to get into some wireless/wired debate in this topic, but there are advantages and disadvantages to each kind, and he's acting like it's worthless if it's not wireless. This is obviously in an attempt to promote their wireless GH3 guitar.

He's throwing $280 like that's what you need to pay for a) the game and b) a wireless guitar controller. You can see, very plainly, that he's careful to exclude any mention of the drums and microphone in any of his response for the pricing (and in the interview as a whole). Now, assuming a wireless 360 guitar is eventually released for Rock Band for $80 and you want to buy it for the game in addition to the bundle, that's $280 for a) the game, b) wired guitar, c) mic, d) drum set, and e) wireless guitar. I think he's afraid to admit that the total price of the standalone Rock Band game + a Rock Band wireless guitar would be very comparable to the price of the standalone Guitar Hero III game + a Guitar Hero wireless guitar.

In short, he makes it sound like GH3 is $100... or you can spend $280 for Rock Band and get the exact same thing. It's really sounding like the only way they can antagonize RB anymore is for its pricing. It's also very interesting how he exclaims innovation in the GH3 guitar by being wireless and unsurprisingly completely neglects to mention the five way effects switch and five additional frets on the RB guitar that look to markedly improve gameplay. I wish they would ask him about the new features on the RB guitar directly. I just want to see what the response would be. I'm betting the word "wireless" would be used no less than five times.

[ThePaska]

If the GH3 guitar does not work with Rock Band, I do not think I am even going to bother buying it, the whole draw for me besides some really fun songs to play was the fact that I could use that guitar for GH 3 and also as a nice bonus use it as my bass for Rock Band.

[karlkaza]

Man!
No wireless guitars for us!
I could care less!

[MrtyMcfly]

If the GH3 guitar does not work with Rock Band, I do not think I am even going to bother buying it, the whole draw for me besides some really fun songs to play was the fact that I could use that guitar for GH 3 and also as a nice bonus use it as my bass for Rock Band.

I don't think it's the dilemma that the GH3 guitar won't work with RB. I think they're trying to make it so that you can't use any 3rd party guitar for GH3.

Whereas, HMX has already said multiple times that you can use any 3rd party guitar for RB.

But man, this guy's a loser, like Magnet was saying, all he can do is hype up his wireless guitar, and the price of Rock Band, even though his comparison is way off! Rock Band is basically 4 games in one, and you can play 4 people at a time! GH3? Single player game, with 2 player capability, with only 1 kind of instrument.

Meanwhile in his mind, it's just like the Penny Arcade comic:
Bob Activision - "Rock Band is going to leave our a**holes in ruins"

[Bakkster_Man]

Really, did anyone expect Red Octane, a company that has traditionally made it's money manufacturing tiny toy instruments/dance pads, to not do everything in their power to keep people from using 3rd party devices? The dashboard update on the 360 would hint that they've done something beyond using the standard controller inputs wirelessly to insure that their controller is incompatible with Rock Band.

Really, it's odd that a company that started with 3rd party hardware is now actively trying to fight... third party hardware! I wish they would remember that and show a little bit more of a spirit of cooperation. There's room on everybody's shelves for RB and GH3, but not if the hardware isn't compatible. Activision/RO is what's turning this into a war, instead of a friendly competition where we can all enjoy two of our favorite franchises...

[MotleyPriest111]

I think the competition is good only in some parts. If they are trying to compete to get the most songs, that's good. If they are trying to compete to get exclusive songs, then the problem arises.

[TheTogfather]

If the GH3 guitar does not work with Rock Band, I do not think I am even going to bother buying it, the whole draw for me besides some really fun songs to play was the fact that I could use that guitar for GH 3 and also as a nice bonus use it as my bass for Rock Band.

Unless they were lying, Harmonix has always stated that the GH3 guitar will DEFINATELY work with Rock Band. It was explained that it is HMX's job to make sure the Rock Band software is compatible with the GH3 guitar. Makes sense. Conversely then, it would be Neversoft's job to make sure the GH3 software works with the Rock Band guitar.

Now, after readin this article, I think it's farily safe to assume that Neversoft and company will not be allowing the Rock Band guitar to work with their software. Harmonix has been consistently quoted as saying, "We want to make sure that the hardward is as cross-compatible as possible, as that is what gamers would expect." And their doing it. Red Octane, on the other hand, is saying "**** you."

So, to recap...HMX/MTV/EA = good guys. Red Octane/Neversoft/Activision = bad guys.

And I am one step closer to buying only the GH3 guitar and not the game.

[MrtyMcfly]

And I am one step closer to buying only the GH3 guitar and not the game.

I'm just curious, why would you want the guitar but not the game? If you're not getting the GH3 bundle, why waste your money on a crappy GH3 guitar and just get an extra Strat?

I, myself, am going to be buying just the GH3 game and going to continue just using my Xplorer. Unless for some stupid reason they don't let those work either :eek:

[TheTogfather]

I'm just curious, why would you want the guitar but not the game? If you're not getting the GH3 bundle, why waste your money on a crappy GH3 guitar and just get an extra Strat?

I, myself, am going to be buying just the GH3 game and going to continue just using my Xplorer. Unless for some stupid reason they don't let those work either :eek:

I have an unhealthy obsession with the Gibson Les Paul...and I do not have GH2 on the 360, so need to get a second guitar somehow. As to why I don't just pick up 2 Rock Band guitars, meh...variety is nice and it's doubtful the second player would use the top frets thing much anyway.

But it's mostly the obsession thing. Seriously...from the moment I saw it I knew I had to have it.

[Bakkster_Man]

So, to recap...HMX/MTV/EA = good guys. Red Octane/Neversoft/Activision = bad guys.

And I am one step closer to buying only the GH3 guitar and not the game.

Buying the guitar and not the game is just giving them money, and at a higher profit margin than the bundle (probably, usually bundles are subsidized, so they make slightly less profit %-wise).


I'm just curious, why would you want the guitar but not the game? If you're not getting the GH3 bundle, why waste your money on a crappy GH3 guitar and just get an extra Strat?

Well, it's wireless and shaped like a Les Paul. Beyond that, I've got nothing.

[TheTogfather]

Buying the guitar and not the game is just giving them money, and at a higher profit margin than the bundle (probably, usually bundles are subsidized, so they make slightly less profit %-wise).


Hmmm...good point. If someone would prove to me that they would get less of a profit off of me buying the bundle instead of me just buying the guitar, then I may as well pick up the game too.

(bah, who am I kidding...I'm sure I'll end up getting it. I'll just hate myself for it.)

[WildWalker]

....and beyond to Guitar Hero IV




Whoohoo - bring it on

[Electric_Zen]

Unless they were lying, Harmonix has always stated that the GH3 guitar will DEFINATELY work with Rock Band.

Guys, please don't make things tougher on Harmonix by spreading false information like this.

Harmonix has stated they will support the GH2 Explorer Guitar in Rock Band, and Charles acknowledged as such: "they can make it work with our previous guitars, and they're able to piggyback on the install base we've created"

(Sorry for the sidenote, but didn't Harmonix also help to create that install base?)

Harmonix has said that they are basically at Activision's mercy in terms of being able to support the GH3 controllers, and Charles makes it pretty clear that they don't intend to play ball.

[Bakkster_Man]

Hmmm...good point. If someone would prove to me that they would get less of a profit off of me buying the bundle instead of me just buying the guitar, then I may as well pick up the game too.

(bah, who am I kidding...I'm sure I'll end up getting it. I'll just hate myself for it.)

The way to maximize everything would be to have RB, with 2 Strats, and GH3. If Neversoft/RO doesn't allow that, then the only way to have only 4 peripherals is with 2 Les Pauls, drums, mic. Of course, there is extra functionality to the Strat, so out the window it goes again.

I'm sure one of my friends will get GH3, so I'll keep my money for RB.

[Magnet]

Unless they were lying, Harmonix has always stated that the GH3 guitar will DEFINATELY work with Rock Band.

I don't recall ever seeing that. I remember them stating that the GH2 X-Plorer guitar would definitely work with Rock Band (since that was out already and they could test that themselves). I would very much like to see where Harmonix stated that the GH3 guitar would work with RB. Please post a link if you can.

Edit: I guess Electric_Zen beat me to the punch

[MrtyMcfly]

I don't recall ever seeing that. I remember them stating that the GH2 X-Plorer guitar would definitely work with Rock Band (since that was out already and they could test that themselves). I would very much like to see where Harmonix stated that the GH3 guitar would work with RB. Please post a link if you can.




http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i140/mrtymcfly1984/Guitar.jpg

Says it all

Again, the interview is speaking of the RB guitar NOT working with GH3, not vice versa.

Any guitar you want to use CAN be used on Rock Band. But it's RO and/or Activision that is not allowing other third party peripherals.

[Bakkster_Man]

It should be simple enough for HMX to support the GH3 guitar. Once it comes out they just need to reverse engineer it, write code to use it, then put up a patch. I can't think of any way RO/Activision would prevent this.

[Electric_Zen]

You are misreading that to say what you want it to say, Marty. They are not promising to work with every conceivable guitar controller that will ever be produced.

They have said that they will support guitars whenever interoperability is possible.

[MrtyMcfly]

It should be simple enough for HMX to support the GH3 guitar. Once it comes out they just need to reverse engineer it, write code to use it, then put up a patch. I can't think of any way RO/Activision would prevent this.

That's the thing. That's why there was an Xbox update. RO/Activision has used some new way of creating a wireless controller so that it can recognize it.

This way when GH3 is being played, it will recognize the controller, but at the same time, making sure it doesn't recognize others, i.e. the Stratocaster.

[Electric_Zen]

It should be simple enough for HMX to support the GH3 guitar. Once it comes out they just need to reverse engineer it, write code to use it, then put up a patch. I can't think of any way RO/Activision would prevent this.

I think you're right about this, Bakkster, unless Red Octane has a dirty trick up their sleeve. But I doubt we will see support in 2007.

[Ghaleon]

Unless they were lying, Harmonix has always stated that the GH3 guitar will DEFINATELY work with Rock Band.

So, to recap...HMX/MTV/EA = good guys. Red Octane/Neversoft/Activision = bad guys.


Two things:

First, as previously mentioned, and easilly confirmed by clicking the FAQ link at the top of every page, Harmonix said "We intend on supporting the X-Plorer guitar controller" in regards to compatibility, that is the GH2 wired controller for the Xbox 360.

And second, it's really not fair to generalize "good guys" and "bad guys". Red Octane has a vested intrest in making money off the sales of the controllers they manufacture. MTV, on the other hand, will likely be farming out manufacture of the guitars to a 3rd party as their main interest in making money appears to be the sale of new music as downloads post release.

The publishers/distributors are focused on how to maximize the money made from a product, I severely doubt the folks at Neversoft bear any ill will towards Harmonix; and likewise for the converse.

It's a business, and from our view as consumers apparent lack of interoperability is certainly disappointing and some of the comments being made in interviews like these are a bit more snarky than necessary... But then again Activision paid good money for a brand name, and they've got good reason to worry that, over time, the brand will prove less useful than the creative energies behind it's original success.

[MrtyMcfly]

You are misreading that to say what you want it to say, Marty. They are not promising to work with every conceivable guitar controller that will ever be produced.

They have said that they will support guitars whenever interoperability is possible.

Oh wait, I see what you're saying.

"when they're supported by Rock Band's open source software" Which means if RO/Activision chooses not to support it, then it won't work.

Basically I guess it's saying that HMX is allowing any guitar controller to work, if that company who makes it chooses to do so.

So not only has HMX put the ball in RO's court to let Strats work for GH3, but they've also left it open so that the Gibsons can work for RB.

But, because of the "competitive standpoint" Activision is taking, it seems as though neither guitar will work for either game other than it's own.

[Magnet]

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i140/mrtymcfly1984/Guitar.jpg

Says it all

That portion just says "guitars supported by Rock Band's "open source" software." It's very possible that the GH3 guitars will not be supported by RB's "open source" software.


Any guitar you want to use CAN be used on Rock Band. But it's RO and/or Activision that is not allowing other third party peripherals.

Rock Band still has to be able to detect and interpret the guitar correctly through its software. If RedOctane is manufacturing the GH3 guitars in such a way that it's unlikely RB will be able to interpret it correctly, then it would not be compatible with RB. I imagine they're only talking about third-party guitars specifically designed for RB in the future using Rock Band's open source software for compatibility.

I guess it's possible that RB could release a software update to include compatibility with the GH3 guitars in the future if it's not ready by launch, but who knows if RedOctane/Activision would like or maybe even allow it. In fact, allowing compatibility for GH3 guitars for RB might even lead to some kind of lawsuit. I don't think many of us beyond Harmonix and RedOctane employees really understand the intricacies of all of this. I wish someone from one of the companies would just come right out and talk about GH3 and RB guitar compatibilities. Answer all the questions definitively and get it over with. It'd save a lot of headaches.

[MrtyMcfly]

See my post above, I answered my own question/answer lol

[Magnet]

Yeah, I saw that afterward. I posted just a tad too late. ;)

[gh2masterwellalmost]

I got the X-Plorer. Ill be using that, one player cos with friends it'll be RB, on GH3, then later on buy the RB guitar, then if someones round me house ill have my X-Plorer for Rhythm, and Strat for Lead (cos i REALLY need those extra frets for solos... U DONT HAVE TO STRUM!)

So there ya, go just my solution to the problem. What? You don't have a GH2 guitar? You're stuffed...

[MotleyPriest111]

I don't like the 'not strumming' aspect. I like to hold down the frets prior to the note's arrival. But in a solo, note are coming at you fast, so it'll be mostly hammer ons and pull offs, which is in turn, 'not strumming'.

[gh2masterwellalmost]

I don't like the 'not strumming' aspect. I like to hold down the frets prior to the note's arrival. But in a solo, note are coming at you fast, so it'll be mostly hammer ons and pull offs, which is in turn, 'not strumming'.

Mostly hammer ons and pull offs. If you miss a hammer on/pull off note, then you have to strum again. Then, while you're finding this all out your meter is red and you'll like: "when am i ever gonna finish jordan without hyperspeed". Hmmm, maybe its just me :D

[MotleyPriest111]

HAHAHA! Jokes on you! .... .... .... .... I already beat Jordan on Expert.

[gh2masterwellalmost]

HAHAHA! Jokes on you! .... .... .... .... I already beat Jordan on Expert.

Bit out of order and ott over a song...

[TheTogfather]

I don't really feel like searching for it, but I SWEAR I read that HMX said, with no reservations, that the GH3 guitar will work with Rock Band. Seriously, I'd heard that so much that it's become fact in my brain...

[jlc510]

I haven't read the full interview, but from what's been quoted here, instead of talking about the positive aspects of GH3, the RO person is trashing Rock Band. That shows me how intimidated they are of this game. From all of the things I've read from HMX they're all happy and excited about how RB is turning out, I've yet to see them say anything negative about Red Octane or GH3. I think that's mainly because they know how much of a better game they have on their hands. Red Octane is running scared and is increasingly loosing my respect. I know in a recent past edition of EGM Activision wouldn't cooperate in an article to compare RB and GH3. But yea the more Red Octane or Activision or anyone else associated with GH3 wants try to disuade people from RB, it just shows a total lack of confidence they have in GH3.

[Electric_Zen]

Red Octane is running scared.

That might be overstating it a little bit. Harmonix is going to conquer the world, but make no mistake about it, GH3 will kill Rock Band in sales this holiday season.

GH3 is doing a worldwide release this fall on all platforms, including the two most popular consoles, PS2 and Wii.

Rock Band will be doing a North American release on the third-and-fourth most popular platforms, XBox 360 and PS3.

So Activision will make their nice chunk of change this year from the Red Octane buyout. But next year, look for Guitar Hero to be losing steam while Harmonix is just getting started.

[vichnaiev]

That might be overstating it a little bit. Harmonix is going to conquer the world, but make no mistake about it, GH3 will kill Rock Band in sales this holiday season.

GH3 is doing a worldwide release this fall on all platforms, including the two most popular consoles, PS2 and Wii.

Rock Band will be doing a North American release on the third-and-fourth most popular platforms, XBox 360 and PS3.

So Activision will make their nice chunk of change this year from the Red Octane buyout. But next year, look for Guitar Hero to be losing steam while Harmonix is just getting started.

That's a very good point. PS2 and Wii are extremely popular and GH3 will sell millions for those people who don't want or don't have the $$ to upgrade to a real next-gen system. But don't forget that xbox360 has a larger install base than Wii, even if that is for a short period of time.

Anyway, the comic strip from PA is just awesome. Activision has this holiday to sell it's game, cause the coming GH4 won't sell **** and when they realize they HAVE to get a full band running it will be too late. HMX was just brilliant selling a guitar franchise and creating a band one. You want this limited game ?? Pay for it, we're moving on to something better, we're not using it anyway.

[AlexGW]

I was sure there was a wireless guitar for RB, its just sold seperatly and not bundled with the RB Special Edition. Google for it, or browse Amazon for RB, its there!

Anyways, do any of you rekon the RB strat would work with the 360 versions of GH2 and upcoming GH3? Because if its all that its hyped up to be, wouldn't you want to use it in some future nostalgic moment back to GH2? Would be cool if it could..

[monoxidehektik]

That's a very good point. PS2 and Wii are extremely popular and GH3 will sell millions for those people who don't want or don't have the $$ to upgrade to a real next-gen system. But don't forget that xbox360 has a larger install base than Wii, even if that is for a short period of time.

Anyway, the comic strip from PA is just awesome. Activision has this holiday to sell it's game, cause the coming GH4 won't sell **** and when they realize they HAVE to get a full band running it will be too late. HMX was just brilliant selling a guitar franchise and creating a band one. You want this limited game ?? Pay for it, we're moving on to something better, we're not using it anyway.

HMX didn't sell anything. activision bought RO and decided to have somebody else work on it. It just freed HMX to do what they really want, and EA knew that that was what's up

[SmokaCola]

Kids will still buy GHIII though, some of them are just too stupid to realize RB will be better in the end. Never really understood the whole wanting to be hardcore to the game, I mean if something out there is better than what you've been doing go for it =\. As for the pricing, if it does magically go to 300 i'd still buy it. Hell think about it like this, 100 for GH3 + Guitar. 140 for the RB Game + Guitar (at the prices expected to be atm). Now look at the controllers, sure GHIII has a nice controller and all, But just take a look at the RB controller. You have 5 extra buttons for fun factor, an effect switch, plus it looks a lot sexier and it's bigger.

Even if the RB controller is wired only for 360 it doesn't really matter... I've played with wired/wireless guitar/regular controllers and honestly as far as a normal controller goes I want wireless. When it comes down to it though, I want a wire on my guitar controller. It just doesn't feel like the "Real Guitar" feeling without the wire. I could understand why some people would like it though, makes it easier to "rock out" when no one else is around or you and your friends are acting crazy :P.

[R0ck3r]

Kids will still buy GHIII though, some of them are just too stupid to realize RB will be better in the end. Never really understood the whole wanting to be hardcore to the game, I mean if something out there is better than what you've been doing go for it =\. As for the pricing, if it does magically go to 300 i'd still buy it. Hell think about it like this, 100 for GH3 + Guitar. 140 for the RB Game + Guitar (at the prices expected to be atm). Now look at the controllers, sure GHIII has a nice controller and all, But just take a look at the RB controller. You have 5 extra buttons for fun factor, an effect switch, plus it looks a lot sexier and it's bigger.

Even if the RB controller is wired only for 360 it doesn't really matter... I've played with wired/wireless guitar/regular controllers and honestly as far as a normal controller goes I want wireless. When it comes down to it though, I want a wire on my guitar controller. It just doesn't feel like the "Real Guitar" feeling without the wire. I could understand why some people would like it though, makes it easier to "rock out" when no one else is around or you and your friends are acting crazy :P.

I'm probably going to buy both bundles so IF it works I would have strat, les paul, drums, and mic along with the 2 games. Then if I get tired of RB for a bit (lol like that will ever happen) I'll just play GH3. Then again GH3 would just be something to keep me entertained until RB comes out...

[SmokaCola]

Yeah, I'm still getting GH3 as well. Honestly I like GHIII's setlist a lot more than rock bands, but I feel the more DLC that shows up the better the songs will be be. As for the kids screaming GHIII is going to best the best... I feel really bad for them. As I've said, GHIII will be a great game, but RB will be better for the simple fact that's it's a lot more advanced. Plus it doesn't have stupid power ups ( i hope it doesn't anyone, that will ruin GHIII Tbh. Last thing I want to do is battle someone online and they beat me only because they got lucky on a power up, ruins the whole experience. )

[Axel32]

The only way you could spend $280 for RB right now is if you bought the bundle.. then a wireless controller to top the cake..

Also! Here's a marketing scheme to rebuttal GH's thunder. I think their should be 4 types of the game you could buy.. the Guitar pack, the Singer pack, the drum pack, and the band pack. Their all basically self explanatory.. guitar pack being the equivalent to GH.. Drum pack the equiv of GH but with drums instead.. and the rest explains itself. But there should be another thing included in the packs.. "Cases" for the instrument so we can easily haul then from gig to gig (house to house) What I mean buy cases.. I'm not talking like 40-60 dollor cases that are very nice.. but that (third party?) case that came out for GH that was maybe 14.99..

[crunchyoverseas]

I'm not spending a dime on GHIII until I see a confirmed report that it will work on rockband...if that means I don't get it until after November 20th, then so be it. I was going to use their guitar as a bass for rockband, but I can just use my GHII controller...

poop on them....:(

[ductyl]

I'm not spending a dime on GHIII until I see a confirmed report that it will work on rockband...if that means I don't get it until after November 20th, then so be it.

Yeah, I'm hoping once GH3 is out someone at HMX can test a guitar for us ;)

- ductyl

[Brock_Landers]

As far as in your territory, Australia and New Zealand, I have two predictions: one is, I don't think it will actually ship this Christmas in Australia/New Zealand

Breaking News!!!~
THIS JUST IN: CHARLES HUANG PREDICTS THAT THE SUN WILL RISE IN THE MORNING AND THAT FAT KIDS WILL EAT CAKE.

But yeah, reading this guy is just too much of a joke.. the worst thing about it is that a bunch of people are gonna read it and be like "$300? Holy crap. lol I'm not buying that dumbhead game!"

This is why months ago, I said that there needs to me more marketing focus on how you can still get uber quality soley out of having one peripheral for the minimum price. Common sense? Sure. Unfortunately people are also stupid (and in this case easily mislead by yellowbelly toy guitar makers).

Course, lack of any kind of pricing doesn't help matters.. hopefully it'll all get cleared up when they actually announce SKUs.

[Insignificant_Other]

I'm curious how Red Octane will handle this on the PS3 side. I own, as do most PS2-owning GH fans, GHI, II, and 80s, but the current PS controllers are NOT compatible with the PS3. That means I simply cannot play these games on my PS3 (which incidentally is the only reason I still have a PS2 set up).

As a consumer I am fully expecting that when GHIII comes out, the PS3 controller will enable me to finally play the earlier games on the PS3. I know I'm not alone on this.

The problem for Red Octane, then, is that if they want to make their PS3 controllers backwards compatible with the older games (as I think every fan has a right to expect), then won't that make it hard for them to also prevent their working with RB, since Harmonix knows the old controller technology intimately?

I've gotta say, if Red Octane purposely breaks backwards compatibility with the earlier games just to prevent use with RB, I'll be one pissed-off customer. Taking reasonable steps to protect your investment is one thing, but totally screwing your customers in order to do it is another.

[FreQstar]

I'm curious how Red Octane will handle this on the PS3 side. I own, as do most PS2-owning GH fans, GHI, II, and 80s, but the current PS controllers are NOT compatible with the PS3. That means I simply cannot play these games on my PS3 (which incidentally is the only reason I still have a PS2 set up).

As a consumer I am fully expecting that when GHIII comes out, the PS3 controller will enable me to finally play the earlier games on the PS3. I know I'm not alone on this.

The problem for Red Octane, then, is that if they want to make their PS3 controllers backwards compatible with the older games (as I think every fan has a right to expect), then won't that make it hard for them to also prevent their working with RB, since Harmonix knows the old controller technology intimately?

I've gotta say, if Red Octane purposely breaks backwards compatibility with the earlier games just to prevent use with RB, I'll be one pissed-off customer. Taking reasonable steps to protect your investment is one thing, but totally screwing your customers in order to do it is another.

Can't check the GH forums to link the verification of this right now so that might not be totally correct, but in the faq there I am pretty sure they've already said the ps3 les paul is NOT fully backwards compatible with the the ps2 GHs.

[PurpleHaze]

Can't check the GH forums to link the verification of this right now so that might not be totally correct, but in the faq there I am pretty sure they've already said the ps3 les paul is NOT fully backwards compatible with the the ps2 GHs.

Correct, the FAQ (http://forum.guitarherogame.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=29097) on the GH forums says:

"The new PS3 Les Paul wireless controller will NOT work at all with any of the Playstation2 Guitar Hero titles when played on the PS3. We suggest that you keep your PS2 console around to play the older PS2 Guitar Hero games."

[Insignificant_Other]

Correct, the FAQ (http://forum.guitarherogame.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=29097) on the GH forums says:

"The new PS3 Les Paul wireless controller will NOT work at all with any of the Playstation2 Guitar Hero titles when played on the PS3. We suggest that you keep your PS2 console around to play the older PS2 Guitar Hero games."

Well now they've really pissed me off. Why would I want to keep my PS2 system around just to play GHI and II, when pretty much every other PS2 game under the sun works on the PS3 (and with a resulting graphics upscaling to boot)? What possible reason could they have to break compatibility with their own games? Unless of course that is the only way to prevent RB's controllers from working with GHIII. I noticed, also, that the FAQ is actually worded "Correction: The new PS3..." suggesting that they had earlier stated it would work. Suspicious? YOU DECIDE ;)

I wonder if there is any chance that the RB controller will work with GHI and II. Now that would be ironic, and would make me Harmonix's b-otch for life...

[Chris_Gonzalez]

What possible reason could they have to break compatibility with their own games?

One word: Harmonix.

[Apples]

I fully expect Red Octane and GH3 to break all compatibility guidelines.

This is the same company that can't release a uniform set of GH2 songs across two platforms, forcing consumers into ridiculous purchasing decisions if they want a full songlist. (GH 80's I am looking at you :mad: )

They have burned too many bridges to have anything less than cynical expectations. IMHO the proper strategy (which I am using) with regards to GH3 is to get the standalone game, and then use the Xplorer. The only controller I am remotely interested in this generation is a Stratocaster since it has actual "innovation" in the form of new features.

[sushi111]

Damn it. I just know this means that with GH4 they're going to do something with the guitar to make sure the games (GH and RB) will no longer share the same peripheral abilities.


Guess what game series Im finished with?!?!?!

[NotorietyH]

I'm seriously considering cancelling my order for GH III right now, only reason I'm getting it is to tide me over for a couple of weeks until Rock Band comes out then use the controller as the Bass for Rock Band. If it doesn't work then f*ck 'em. I'll either buy another Strat or buy GH III, smash the controller into tiny pieces, put said pieces into a box, take a hefty crap into the same box and mail it back to Red Octane, then buy the Strat. Depends how much money I get for my birthday :P

[Quinarvy]

Do the RedOctane and Activision heads just sit in dark rooms all day with pistols aimed at their feet just waiting to pull the trigger?

And dangit...now I need a new bass controller.

[Alphadown99]

I don't think it's the dilemma that the GH3 guitar won't work with RB. I think they're trying to make it so that you can't use any 3rd party guitar for GH3.

Whereas, HMX has already said multiple times that you can use any 3rd party guitar for RB.

But man, this guy's a loser, like Magnet was saying, all he can do is hype up his wireless guitar, and the price of Rock Band, even though his comparison is way off! Rock Band is basically 4 games in one, and you can play 4 people at a time! GH3? Single player game, with 2 player capability, with only 1 kind of instrument.

Meanwhile in his mind, it's just like the Penny Arcade comic:
Bob Activision - "Rock Band is going to leave our a**holes in ruins"

If the Rock Band controller doesn't work with GH games, then I'll take GHIII back when i get it for Christmas and use the money to save for the wireless strat

[bumbousdude25]

I do not believe that Microsoft will be seeing a Rock Band wireless guitar in 2007.

Well, we already know they won't! HMX confirmed we won't see wireless stuff until at least early 2008.

[HPLabonte]

ooooooooold ooooold mega epic bump!?

[Electric_Zen]

Well, we already know they won't!

Thanks, bumbous. We didn't know it when I wrote this two and a half months ago.