Rock Band compatibility questions answered....but not really...

[agar_agar]

Well… you can’t say we’ve never done anything for you. We went through your comments on our recent “Rock Band” post about the price and release date for the Harmonix/EA/MTV game, and did some digging to get some of your questions answered.

We went straight to the source (coincidently the source has the same bosses we do) and asked some of the lingering questions about hardware compatibility, USB hubs, and that little white box known as the Wii. Hit the jump to find answers to some of your burning questions.
Grandlear asked, “Is there a network ability to play with others across the internet?”
“Rock Band” PR rep: Yes, there will be multiplayer online functionality. It will be both cooperative and competitive.

imsneakierthanu2 wanted to know, “For the Ps3 version, the guitar from ‘Guitar Hero III’ won’t be compatible with ‘Rock Band’? True?”
“RB”: Harmonix has an open platform philosophy and their games will be compatible with third-party controllers that conform to the various platform controller standards.

mike hasn’t gone next-gen yet, and needs to know about his PS2, “So does the PS2 version work with Guitar Hero controllers?”
“RB“: Harmonix has an open platform philosophy and their games will be compatible with third-party controllers that conform to the various platform controller standards.

Erwin was curious about the bass controller, asking, “What about the bass? Do we need to buy it separately?”
“RB”: The Fender Stratocaster ‘Rock Band’ guitar will function as both the lead guitar as well as bass. In terms of getting another guitar to play either guitar or bass, consumers can either use another Fender Stratocaster ‘Rock Band’ guitar or use another guitar controller as Harmonix has an open platform philosophy and their games will be compatible with third-party controllers that conform to the various platform controller standards.

We got some clarity for Gazpachoking about the USB hub, “Does the 360 bundle come with a USB hub?”
“RB”: Yes

Mr. Krinkle asked the obvious question that has been on a lot of peoples’ minds, “Is there any Wii version in the works?”
“RB”: We have only announced “Rock Band” for the Xbox 360, PS3 and the PS2. Stay tuned for more announcements.

I pwn n00bs (who was recently ousted out of his band) and darkbola , wanted to know about other hardware combinations asking, “Will there be a compatible microphone and lead guitar or bass guitar combo?”
“RB“: We have not finalized the plans as of yet.

Hopefully this has helped answer some of your outstanding questions, but we are sure there are more. Ask away and we will can see what we can find out.

http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/2007/10/09/your-rock-band-questions-answered-guitar-hero-compatibility-bundles-etc/

[chaopolis]

I love marketing spokespeople and their robotic responses... They always make it feel so personal... :p

[Magnet]

Yeah...nothing in there that we didn't already know. But at least it's something.

[Ninegauger]

Is it possible that they're saying "yes they are compatible" but without wanting to mention the competition?

[AeroTrain]

We're not all programmers who are savvy on open controller standards.

At the very least, HMX knows if RB is compatible with Guitar Hero I & II controllers. Just say the words already! Make it clear. Why be so intentionally vague?

Tell the pencil neck lawyers to stuff it already and be forthright with your customers.

[tbradshaw]

We're not all programmers who are savvy on open controller standards.

At the very least, HMX knows if RB is compatible with Guitar Hero I & II controllers. Just say the words already! Make it clear. Why be so intentionally vague?

Tell the pencil neck lawyers to stuff it already and be forthright with your customers.

Because they can't speak on behalf of another company. This statement is not vague at all, let me clarify it for you more:

"All controllers that are 'standard' work with Rock Band."

There are two possible outcomes:

1) RedOctane controllers for GH1/GH2/GH3 are standard, correctly conforming controllers and they will work with Rock Band.

2) RedOctane controllers for GH1/GH2/GH3 are non-conforming, "hackish" controllers that require specialized software to work and will not work with Rock Band.

They will not be any more specific for a matching set of reasons:

1) Making a public statement discourages purchases of the Rock Band guitars. This would be a bummer for both revenue and developer satisfaction. (They just developed some awesome controllers for their game, of course they don't want you to play with inferior controllers... why would they encourage that?)

2) Making a public statement to this effect is a professional attack on RedOctane and grossly irresponsible as a fellow member of the gaming industry.

The only reason this sounds like a "marketing robot" response is because the interviewer kept asking the same question in slightly different variations. There is no better answer that Harmonix, MTV Games, EA, Red Octane, Activision, or Neversoft can provide at this point.

I wish that as a community we could just get past these compatibility questions. It's already settled. Harmonix is supporting absolutely any controlller that is standards conforming. It does no good to ask this question anymore, there's nothing more that Harmonix should do. It's not Harmonix' job to fetch competitors products and freaking test them.

If you want a conclusive answer, then someone should ask RedOctane: "Is your Guitar Hero controller a standard conforming controller or have you made special exceptions to the standard for your games?"

[Tendoza]

I really want the les paul to work on Rock Band, and Im not sure if this entirely confirms it, it doesn't deny it; but it does lead you to believe it.

This means a lot to me, if the les paul doesn't work on Rock Band, I have no intention of getting GHIII.

[TheRocker]

I really want the les paul to work on Rock Band, and Im not sure if this entirely confirms it, it doesn't deny it; but it does lead you to believe it.

This means a lot to me, if the les paul doesn't work on Rock Band, I have no intention of getting GHIII.

I just want the Strat to work with Gh2 :(

[Tendoza]

I just want the Strat to work with Gh2 :(
Me too, I would assume it though, seeing that the games are made by the same
dev.

[dethklok]

I'm just going to use my X-plorer for bass. I don't see why I should buy a new guitar for GH3 since now i decided I'm going to buy it ;)

Also the X-plorer I will use for GH3, so it all works out. Most of you should consider doing this if you are poor like myself.

[JackBNimble]

http://multiplayerblog.mtv.com/2007/10/09/your-rock-band-questions-answered-guitar-hero-compatibility-bundles-etc/


I'm just going to use my X-plorer for bass. I don't see why I should buy a new guitar for GH3 since now i decided I'm going to buy it ;)

Also the X-plorer I will use for GH3, so it all works out. Most of you should consider doing this if you are poor like myself.

Your x-plorer probably will work for RB but not for GH 3! They have stated that the Les Paul wont work with even GH1,2 or 80's.So your x-plorer ain't gonna work with GH3.Neversoft and redoctane totaly messed with with the contoller scheme to make it incompatable with RB.Funny,even GH's loyal fans who don't want RB are gonna have to pay extra...........I'm willing to bet that RB controllers will work on GH1,2,80's.

[JackBNimble]

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6180442.html?om_act=convert&om_c
lk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;7

[Feigned]

Harmonix has said that the X-plorers will work with Rock Band. In fact, when I was hanging out with John he mentioned that while they were waiting on the new Fenders to come in they would playtest using the old X-plorers.

In theory, if the X-plorers work with both Rock Band and GH3, then the Les Paul from GH3 should work on Rock Band. All signs point to the X-plorer not working on GH3 (which is like shooting themselves in the foot, or shooting us in the foot, I'm not sure which). I should have my copy of GH3 (for the 360) in roughly two weeks time, so I'll plug in the old X-Plorer and see how it goes.

[AeroTrain]

Because they can't speak on behalf of another company. This statement is not vague at all, let me clarify it for you more:

"All controllers that are 'standard' work with Rock Band."

There are two possible outcomes:

1) RedOctane controllers for GH1/GH2/GH3 are standard, correctly conforming controllers and they will work with Rock Band.

2) RedOctane controllers for GH1/GH2/GH3 are non-conforming, "hackish" controllers that require specialized software to work and will not work with Rock Band.

So you're saying an answer with two completely opposite outcomes is "not vague at all" ?

Really? Great argument.




They will not be any more specific for a matching set of reasons:

1) Making a public statement discourages purchases of the Rock Band guitars. This would be a bummer for both revenue and developer satisfaction. (They just developed some awesome controllers for their game, of course they don't want you to play with inferior controllers... why would they encourage that?)

Compatability with existing hareware is a selling point. Especially for such an ambitious and expensive game. If they didn't want to use that as a selling point, they would have made the controller proprietary. You think that they would want to hide the fact that the game might be compatible with the millions of guitar hero controllers already out there?


2) Making a public statement to this effect is a professional attack on RedOctane and grossly irresponsible as a fellow member of the gaming industry.
[/QOUTE]

Simply stating the fact of whether the guitar is compatible with thier game can't be construed as an attack. Either it is or it isn't compatible, no attack necessary, just a fact. Concerning GH I & II, Harmonix was a part of the design. Certainly they would have been involved in whether to conform to industry standards.


[QUOTE=tbradshaw;74949]
The only reason this sounds like a "marketing robot" response is because the interviewer kept asking the same question in slightly different variations. There is no better answer that Harmonix, MTV Games, EA, Red Octane, Activision, or Neversoft can provide at this point.

Yes, they do sound like a marketing robot bacause clearly they are.

Furthermore, a simple 'yes or 'no' would have been an infinitly better answer and they definatly could have provided it while still remaining professional but they chose not to in a very calculated way.





I wish that as a community we could just get past these compatibility questions. It's already settled.


It is? Thanks for clearing that up with your definitive answer of "two possible outcomes".

[PurpleHaze]

All signs point to the X-plorer not working on GH3 (which is like shooting themselves in the foot, or shooting us in the foot, I'm not sure which).
The cross compatibility of the new guitars is still unclear, but RO have actually already clarified on X-plorer compatibility.

From the GH3 FAQ (http://forum.guitarherogame.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=29097):

4. For Xbox 360, will the X-plorer wired controller work on GH3 and will the Les Paul wireless work on GH2?

The X-plorer will work perfectly fine w/GH3 on Xbox 360. The Les Paul wireless will have 100% compatibility with GH2.

[Terranova]

It seems it's just us PS3 owners that are screwed :(

[Feigned]

The cross compatibility of the new guitars is still unclear, but RO have actually already clarified on X-plorer compatibility.

From the GH3 FAQ (http://forum.guitarherogame.com/Default.aspx?g=posts&t=29097):

4. For Xbox 360, will the X-plorer wired controller work on GH3 and will the Les Paul wireless work on GH2?

The X-plorer will work perfectly fine w/GH3 on Xbox 360. The Les Paul wireless will have 100% compatibility with GH2.

Thanks for posting, that is indeed good news. I'm not sure how they would go about making the X-plorer work with GH3 and make the Les Paul incompatible with RB.

It is sad for the PS3 owners though, I'm glad I went with a 360.

[Chris_Gonzalez]

This interview <i>still</i> hasn't answered my biggest question about the controller: will the PS3 Fender work with Guitar Hero 1, 2, and 80s? Yes, I know the Les Paul won't work with them, but there has been nothing said about the Fender. And I believe that if the PS3 Fender works fine on both the PS3 and the PS2, I don't see why it shouldn't be backwards compatible.

[hunterkiller1983]

I don't know if a 3rd party guitar like the nyko frontman wireless guitar for ps2 will work via the bundled usb cable(it will lose it's wireless functionnality) or via a ps2 to ps3 controller adapter for the rockband game ???

I hope so

[Terranova]

This interview <i>still</i> hasn't answered my biggest question about the controller: will the PS3 Fender work with Guitar Hero 1, 2, and 80s? Yes, I know the Les Paul won't work with them, but there has been nothing said about the Fender. And I believe that if the PS3 Fender works fine on both the PS3 and the PS2, I don't see why it shouldn't be backwards compatible.

I'm wondering the same thing.. RO wont say where the problem lies with the BC issue all RO will say is the Les Paul wont work, As for HMX they haven't said anything about it at all, i wish they would say one way or the other so I can move on with the whole BC issue, but even if it's software related i cant see how HMX could patch the games for them to work the BC is controlled by Sony and they have already stated they don't support third party controllers so they wont do anything to the PS3 BC to make it work, and now with BC gone altogether with newer 40GB models that's even more reason for Sony not to do anything.

[Terranova]

I don't know if a 3rd party guitar like the nyko frontman wireless guitar for ps2 will work via the bundled usb cable(it will lose it's wireless functionnality) or via a ps2 to ps3 controller adapter for the rockband game ???

I hope so

Rock band doesn't come with a USB cable for the PS3 version it uses a dongle that plugs into the USb port, it's the 360 version that uses a USB cable as the bundled version is wired for that.

As for the PS2 to PS3 adapters only one works even then it doesn't give full functionality, you cant do hammer on's or pull offs the whammy bar doesn't always work and nether does tilt support so it's a waste of time getting one.

[tbradshaw]

So you're saying an answer with two completely opposite outcomes is "not vague at all" ?

Really? Great argument.

Definitely. There are two parties involved and an accepted interface. Like a little diagram:

[ Rock Band Software ] <==Standard Controller Specification==> [ Guitar Controllers ]

When asked if a guitar controller will work with Rock Band software, they answered with the best and most correct answer possible. That they have developed their software to work with all controllers that correctly implement the standard controller specification.

Concrete. Final. No better, more specific answer is possible for the Rock Band team. Any other answer would force them to presume something about someone else's product.


Compatability with existing hareware is a selling point. Especially for such an ambitious and expensive game. If they didn't want to use that as a selling point, they would have made the controller proprietary.

No, that's not true. There is an established controller standard that all controllers for modern consoles are "required" to follow. If they made any sort of "proprietary" extensions to the controller standard, that would mean that the controller is broken (from an engineering standpoint). Breaking things like this is considered a poor business practice. (Like Microsoft's behavior in the software world with "embrace and extend". It's common but it's unethical.)


You think that they would want to hide the fact that the game might be compatible with the millions of guitar hero controllers already out there?

They aren't hiding any facts. They have definitively answered that they have implemented a compliant piece of hardware and software that works with all other compliant hardware. This is as far as they can go without making presumptions about someone else's product!


Simply stating the fact of whether the guitar is compatible with thier game can't be construed as an attack. Either it is or it isn't compatible, no attack necessary, just a fact. Concerning GH I & II, Harmonix was a part of the design. Certainly they would have been involved in whether to conform to industry standards.

Yes, it is. They have made very clear that they support the controller specification and all controllers that conform to that specification. If they say, "Well, every controller except for the Guitar Hero 3 controllers from Red Octane," then they are pretty much saying that the Red Octane guy are either incompetent or participating in poor business practices.

Regarding the GH2 controllers, we've already seen them used for Rock Band in a bunch of videos. They can't make any comments about Guitar Hero stuff because they left those products under the ownership of Red Octane when they split.


Yes, they do sound like a marketing robot bacause clearly they are.

Furthermore, a simple 'yes or 'no' would have been an infinitly better answer and they definatly could have provided it while still remaining professional but they chose not to in a very calculated way.

No. As an engineer, I recognize this as the best possible answer. If it were a marketing robot response, it would have been something like. "We're unable to comment on that, but would like to remind you of ... blah blah blah our things are awesome and the best and whatever ... buy our things."


It is? Thanks for clearing that up with your definitive answer of "two possible outcomes".

Yeah, no problem. I'm sorry you don't get it. Harmonix has been absolutely definitive. At this point, only the Neversoft/Red Octane/Activision group can answer the only remaining question. "Is the GH3 Les Paul controller a standards conforming controller?"

It might not be immediately intuitive that asking a question about the interaction of products from two completely separate designers/manufacturers requires asking two questions--one to each. But that's the way it works. If you want to know if two things are interoperable, you ask both sides if they have correctly implemented a mutual standard.

It's sometimes a bummer that a real, honest, and correct answer sometimes leads to another question. But even casual reading into science shows that that's always been the case.

There are still two possible outcomes because the ball is in Red Octanes court. Harmonix has answered definitively as much as they are legally and ethically allowed.

[Supergeek]

Man, this is getting so confusing. I would love to see a compatibility matrix of hardware versus game/platform.

And I'd like to know why PS3 wireless controllers are supposed to be cheaper when they're all using dongles. Dongle = not the proprietary Xbox 360 wireless protocol.

[AeroTrain]

Blah blah blah blah....



The fact is the question was not answered. It was dodged with mumbo jumbo nobody can seem to decipher into a solid answer. Do you not ee this thread and the ten others like it?

Everything about the GH I & II controllers is already known. The hardware is not a mystery to HMX. Either they are or are not compatable. There can't be any argument about it.

HMX wants compatability for reasons too obvious to bother stating.