anyone worried about guitar difficulty?

[scourge]

There is a lot of talk about the guitar being very dumbed down in this game. All the vids I've seen seem to support this too.

Now I'm really pumped for this game but this could be a real letdown. If the guitar parts end up being boring it will kill the game for me.

It almost doesn't seem possible because I trust Harmonix knows what the're doing.

I don't want to have everyone fighting over the drums while the guitarists are bored out of their minds. Anyone have any info to contradict this?

PLEASE don't let this be the case

[Tendoza]

Anyone have any info to contradict this?

Haha, nope.

There are a few guitar heavy songs, but Rock Band guitar won't be as much of a challenge as GHIII's guitar will. Rock Band is going for over-all fun, while GHIII is going for the same guitar only-fun.

I'm a co-operative kind of guy with lots of GH loving friends, so rock Band is for me.

[HeadShaft713]

Ok, Rockband is like the title Rockband, Harmonix Has to find tracks for the whole band to enjoy.Unlike Guitar Hero Red Octane Focuses More Guitar Oriented Songs, So you have to expect that the guitar is not going to be as hard as in guitar hero I and II and now III.

[OrdealByFire]

Rock Band's gonna be mad easy. It will be fun, for sure, but every video I've seen of guys playing "expert", it looks like they're playing an early on hard song. It's really rather pathetic.

[jq71586]

Ughhhh....

This is not Guitar Band! The songs chosen are not going to have crazy guitar solos. The drums look insanely difficult on many songs and there are tons of songs that have challenging vocals.

Now there are songs that will test Guitar Hero veterans (Highway Star, Enter Sandman, Welcome Home (shudder) and parts of Epic). If you want challenging guitar songs go and buy Guitar Hero 3.

This is the type of game where you get drunk with your buddies. It is not meant to be an individual challenge as much as the Guitar Hero series.

Get over the guitar difficulty. It's going to be fine. I'm a very good GH player too and I don't care because I've never sat behind a drum kit and it's going to take me a month or so to even move to hard probably :D. This is meant to be more of a group game where people can enjoy themselves.

[scourge]

But even some of the easier songs in the Guitar Heroes became pretty difficult on expert.

But the Rock Band vids look VERY easy. Why would Harmonix do this?

Why not keep it the same as they have always? I mean jamming with friends is fun and all, but sooner or later you're gonna want a challenge. I think really challenging songs would be great for a band. Having everyone fight to complete a song would be a blast. And you don't wanna be the guy that blows it for everyone!

[jq71586]

But even some of the easier songs in the Guitar Heroes became pretty difficult on expert.

But the Rock Band vids look VERY easy. Why would Harmonix do this?

Why not keep it the same as they have always? I mean jamming with friends is fun and all, but sooner or later you're gonna want a challenge. I think really challenging songs would be great for a band. Having everyone fight to complete a song would be a blast. And you don't wanna be the guy that blows it for everyone!

Yes, but see, here is the ultimate point I'm sure the Harmonix company is going for. They don't want a bunch of challenging songs that are going to turn people away from this game. They would rather have a less difficult game that appeals to more people. They aren't just aiming for the 14-24 or so age demographic that Guitar Hero sort of focuses on. They want 40 year old parents to play this game with their kids.

And thats the whole thing. Older people will flock to this game because it has bands that they recognize (Rolling Stones, The Police, Boston) but it's not over difficult and frustrating. The more people the game appeals to the more people will buy it and more money for EA/MTV/Harmonix.

[scourge]

^^ thats the response everyone is giving. I'm saying they could still make the guitar parts harder.

Just because its a band game, why does it mean we can't we have a challenging experience? What if the songs in Guitar Hero 3 allowed you to play drums and sing? It would kick ass!

I know the drums will be very challenging, but why are they messing with a formula that works?

[scourge]

Yes, but see, here is the ultimate point I'm sure the Harmonix company is going for. They don't want a bunch of challenging songs that are going to turn people away from this game. They would rather have a less difficult game that appeals to more people. They aren't just aiming for the 14-24 or so age demographic that Guitar Hero sort of focuses on. They want 40 year old parents to play this game with their kids.

And thats the whole thing. Older people will flock to this game because it has bands that they recognize (Rolling Stones, The Police, Boston) but it's not over difficult and frustrating. The more people the game appeals to the more people will buy it and more money for EA/MTV/Harmonix.

But how does it turn people away? They can just play easy and medium.

I was terrible at guitar hero when I first started. Half the fun was getting better and striving to beat songs on higher difficulties. How great would it be if you could do this with guitar, drums , and singing. It would be the ultimate.

Instead I'm afraid it may become boring rather quickly. (god I hope not)

[Magnet]

Why not keep it the same as they have always?

It is exactly the same as it ever was in Guitar Hero. Anyone who really believes otherwise is deluding himself. There has been nothing done to "dumb down" the guitar. If there is a guitar note, you play the note on Expert. If there is a guitar chord, you play the chord on Expert. It's not rocket science. Difficulty only depends on song choices. Song choices for Rock Band focus on all instruments, not just guitar. Hence, why the guitar is easier overall than you'll find in Guitar Hero III.

[jq71586]

^^ thats the response everyone is giving. I'm saying they could still make the guitar parts harder.

Just because its a band game, why does it mean we can't we have a challenging experience? What if the songs in Guitar Hero 3 allowed you to play drums and sing? It would kick ass!

I know the drums will be very challenging, but why are they messing with a formula that works?

Because it's a different game. They want to have all four instruments balanced out and guitar had to take a hit to get some of these songs in here. They still haven't announced the guitar finale yet so there will still probably be a tough song or two to still be announced but it's just a different game. I'm getting both games because there is part of me that still wants have challenging guitar games, but it's just a different game. They just really wanted to separate themselves from the Guitar Hero franchise.

[MartyMcFly]

You're thinking too much in a 1-player frame of mind. This game is more about just having fun playing songs with your buddies.

It's not about spending hours trying to beat a song.

[scourge]

but why can't we have both?

[MartyMcFly]

You can. Just wait for DLC. They've said it will satisfy the challenge hungry players.

It's safe to assume there will be all sorts of songs to try to conquer guitar, drums, and singing with.

[scourge]

^thats the best reply so far. I'm hoping you're right cause I'm getting this game.

[MartyMcFly]

^thats the best reply so far. I'm hoping you're right cause I'm getting this game.

Then you can quote me on it :)

[Feigned]

We should expect to see some DLC that focuses more on the guitar parts. They just needed to focus on the "band" element for the tracks so that they're fun for everyone.

[Saltines]

You can. Just wait for DLC. They've said it will satisfy the challenge hungry players.

It's safe to assume there will be all sorts of songs to try to conquer guitar, drums, and singing with.

This is exactly what I was going to say. DLC will be great, I am 100% sure there will be DLC to fit your needs. I feel somewhat the same about the guitar parts, a little easy. Highway Star better be sweet. But then I realize it's a group oriented game.

[Apples]

To make the whole download strategy work, they are going to want to capture as large a user base as possible. That means giving people a more gradual learning curve. Johnny Newbie doesn't want to get butchered in tier 3 and fail the band out of the setlist.


With scores of Metalica songs confirmed for download, I speculate that the most challenging guitar parts are being reserved for downloads. That way the hardcore crowd can get its fix while the less adept wallow in mediocrity. Remember, the retail disc is not the end all of Rock Band, simply the beginning.

[The_Vampire_Lestat]

That means giving people a more gradual learning curve. Johnny Newbie doesn't want to get butchered in tier 3 and fail the band out of the setlist.





That is why there is easy, medium, hard and expert.

[SmokaCola]

Honestly, I think people are misunderstanding HMX when they say it's been "dumbed" down. What the mean is you won't find yourself playing keyboard parts and such. It's not the fact of it being "dumbed" down, it's just you playing less and honestly that's the way it should be.

As for the videos, yeah they don't look hard but I'd imagine there are some songs out there on expert that you won't be 100%ing anytime soon. Just remember they haven't showed us all the songs, let alone the full songs yet.

[JesterOC]

Honestly, I think people are misunderstanding HMX when they say it's been "dumbed" down. What the mean is you won't find yourself playing keyboard parts and such.

Can you educate me on that line about keyboard parts? Do you mean that in Guitar Hero they increase the difficulty of the songs by adding guitart parts to the songs that are not in the original music (or perhaps they combine the rythem guitar with the lead?)

Thanks

[sa_nick]

Lets not forget that GH3's note charts are sometimes made specifically to be hard, not to be realistic.

Rock Band's are made to be fun and for you to be able to rock out to, that's how I reckon it's gonna work.

[RkBndDrmr]

but why can't we have both?

We have not seen all there is to see. Have we even seen a "hard" guitar solo on expert?
I agree this is and should be about the whole band and not the guitar, I am sure we will see plenty of guitar heavy songs in the form of DLC. But it would be no fun for 3 of the 4 people playing if the guitarist is constantly failing a song.

I'm sure there will be a challenge in this game on guitar just wait..Maybe we'll get a good video from IGN today....HAHA I just said "good" and "IGN" in the same sentence.

[Ardius]

We have not seen all there is to see. Have we even seen a "hard" guitar solo on expert?
I agree this is and should be about the whole band and not the guitar, I am sure we will see plenty of guitar heavy songs in the form of DLC. But it would be no fun for 3 of the 4 people playing if the guitarist is constantly failing a song.

I'm sure there will be a challenge in this game on guitar just wait..Maybe we'll get a good video from IGN today....HAHA I just said "good" and "IGN" in the same sentence.

lol, this thread just keeps repeating itself.
There is a reason for different difficulties....thats not the issue here.

Is everyone being blind to the fact you can have guitar heavy songs where the drums, singing and most imporantly, the bass are all just as difficult? For example, Highway Star is very close to this.
I definitely support the notion of "we want really hard songs!!" because, after playing GH:80s, its just not fun playing rediculously easy patterns, regardless of whether its on coop or not. I want to be challenged at the same time as enjoying the "trust system" that will surely come from playing together.

Regardless, I do not think all the songs are going to be easy, and, as has been mentioned several times in this thread, there will be most assuredly DLC with harder, more challenging tracks on them.

Perhaps we should all think of the game disc as an introduction setlist and then the DLC as "the real meat" of the game. First we enjoy the thrill of learning drums or whatever, then we are served hundreds of rediculously hard tracks to keep us playing.

[mrmooz]

dont worry about the guitar, there are plenty of songs with fun guitar solo's e.g.
black hole sun, cherub rock, dani california, enter sandman, highway star, paranoid, suffragette city, vasoline, wanted dead or alive, and much more. If you look at guitar hero not all song have solo's either, they had some pretty easy songs.

[mrmooz]

Plus there is downloadable content, you never know harmonix could release some mad guitar solo's.

[MartyMcFly]

lol, this thread just keeps repeating itself.
There is a reason for different difficulties....thats not the issue here.

Is everyone being blind to the fact you can have guitar heavy songs where the drums, singing and most imporantly, the bass are all just as difficult?

It's because some people aren't thinking in the multiplayer frame of mind. If you're thinking single player, than yes, Single player Tour Mode will most likely be easier than Guitar Hero. Which is good, I'd rather play fun songs than songs that make me wanna throw my guitar through the TV.

But it's all about the multiplayer, like someone said, you don't wanna be playing tour mode doing one of those mystery marathon gigs and have your guitarist failing because you have these stupid insane guitar solos in them. It's more about having fun, than difficulty.

You want insane difficulty? Wait for DLC.

[nicko68]

That is why there is easy, medium, hard and expert.

On a side note, I feel bad that I can't 5* everything on Hard in GH1 and 80s (haven't tried GH2 yet). Then I remind myself that "Hard" is called "Hard" for a reason. I think I hang around Scorehero too much. :)

[Apples]

The scorehero regulars just got done unveiling their Harmonix visit reviews. I took the opportunity to ask them specifically about the difficulty of guitar and bass.

Even as highly veteran GH fans, they stated that there were guitar/bass parts that they failed throughout their playtesting.

I would take that as a very encouraging sign to address this concern.

[Doshin]

but why can't we have both?

two things:

first, as most people have said, we don't know that you can't, and more and more we're getting reports that you do, and that its not as bad as it was painted initially.

second, if the guitar is easier, its probably because it wouldn't be as fun if it wasn't.

keep in mind, there are people whose job is to make sure the game is the best game it can be, and as many games have proven, over and over, just because something sounds like a good idea (having omg crazy guitar in a band setting) doesn't mean that it is, i don't doubt that HMX probably played around with having crazy metal and stuff in the game, and if they've decided agains *** for the retail shipping, there is probably a reason for it.

While i can't say this about most studios, i trust HMX wholeheartedly that the game they're putting out and giving me, is the best that they had the abillity to make it.

[mobhit101]

Remember, the retail disc is not the end all of Rock Band, simply the beginning.

Ooo, good line! Just put a big fat smile on my face and sent shivers down my spine :D

[hmxsean]

I think we have taken a bit of a knock for our guitar parts not being as difficult and I think that is a bit of a misnomer as lots of "pros" fail out quite nicely and seem to get a good deal of challenge out of it. I think part of this is that most of our songs aren't "metal" as far as genre and lots of people seem to equate that with difficulty which isn't really totally accurate. There are difficult guitar tracks in all genres. I think also a lot of folks think that because we have four instruments we are looking at we aren't just focusing on wicked hard guitar songs. True. But then again I think in every game we have ever worked on we went for a nice balance of songs that were fun, and had a nice progression on difficulty. I think once you get a chance to play the full setlist you will be presently surprised at how hard some of the tracks are.

We're Harmonix, we don't screw around.

[ThePaska]

After reading what the guys at scorehero had to say about their experiences with Rock Band, in addition to what Sean just wrote, I feel fairly confident that there will be challenges found in all four parts of Rock Band, and I look forward to trying to get through all of them (guitar included).

[Quastor]

We're Harmonix, we don't screw around.

QFT. :D

I'm not worried at all. I think with the reported tweaks in timing making you have to be more accurate, it'll introduce an element of difficulty that you can't see when just watching videos. I do find it interesting that people are reporting Rock Band is tighter in terms of timing, and GHIII has actually loosened it from GHII. That could potentially make GHIII parts easier than Rock Band, even though they'd look harder to the eye.

[MartyMcFly]

we aren't just focusing on wicked hard guitar songs.

Best part of that post :D Wicked hahd!
I've used that term while talking to people outside Mass and they're like "what's so evil about it?"

lol

[espher]

You know, as a counter-point to the "that's why there are different difficulty settings" argument, there are also different difficulties of song.

The game doesn't need to be (and shouldn't be) all "hard" songs. Expert should be note-for-note, but every 'tier' doesn't need to be GH2 Tier 6+. It sure as hell wasn't that way in the three Guitar Hero releases (to date), so why should it start now?

Hell, even GH3 has easy-as-piss songs.

[MartyMcFly]

Hell, even GH3 has easy-as-piss songs.

Dragonforce and Slayer.

[espher]

Dragonforce and Slayer.

I didn't say the entire songlist was easy. Sorry for leaving out the word "many".

[scourge]

I'm confident now that there will be tough parts. I also think there will be some crazy dowloadable songs.

I for one am not thinking in a single player mode. My friends and I like a challenge and want to take on tough songs together. I remember one interview mentioning that if someone bombed out, the others kept going and could even bring him back. Thats sweet.

"We're Harmonix, we don't screw around." = "You're sending the wolf? $#!@ thats all you had to say."

I paid for the game in full today. I can't wait!