A Detailed Analysis of DLC

[the_sas_man]

Everyone is talking about how much the DLC (Downloadable Content) should cost, and what songs they would love to hear, but no-one has actually (from what I can see) given this topic any particular thought and proper analysis and it worries me. This reason it worries me is because this feature can ‘potentially’ make this the greatest game of all time IF DONE CORRECTLY. It could also be its biggest downfall if it doesn’t live up to its hype.

This thread is a long analysis of the DLC, so if you can’t be bothered to read it then please don’t comment on it! Likewise, this is only an opinion and all opinions expressed on this thread are welcome as long as it’s constructive and not bashing what people have said for the sheer hell of it. Would be great to hear your thoughts.

The main difference between RockBand and Guitar Hero, (as we all hopefully know) is that Guitar Hero caters purely for those great guitar songs with amazing riffs and solo’s, where as Rockband needs to cater for 3 major groups:

1) The Guitar players (lead/bass)
2) Drummer
3) Vocalist

Therefore the DLC needs to cater for all 3 groups, but more importantly needs to adhere to all of the following characteristics for it to be (in my opinion) successful. Characteristic number 4 is possibly the most important of all the characteristics but also the biggest risk. They are as follows:

1) Teamwork
2) Solos
3) Diversity
4) Risk

I’ll explain each one a little more to explain their importance.

1) TEAMWORK: Each song MUST have that sense of teamwork. There may be time in a song where only the bassist and drummer are playing, or only the guitarist and vocalist – but in the song there must come a point where everyone is rocking it out together. Below is just a few example of a songs which I think match this criteria (please add your own):

· It’s the End of the World as We Know it (R.E.M) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeo0_3gN190) – arguably THE hardest song for the group!
· Ready To Go (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ijh2Fqd1ZPY) – (Republica)
· I Still Haven’t Found What I’m Looking For (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fBj2wsimvQ)(U2)
· Mr Brightside (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnwLf88t_Wc)(The Killers)
· If It Makes You Happy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vA-PcyACc40) (Sherly Crow)
· Hard to Beat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cKNa0DQ0I8) (Hard Fi)
· Before I Fall To Pieces (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_J4sJctPms) – (Razorlight)

2) SOLOS: It just has to be accepted that not all good solo’s are for guitarists. There needs to be an even split in the DLC so it caters for all groups. Guitar solo’s should be weighted slightly more as there are two guitarists on any given song, but the rest should be split fairly. We just have to accept that some songs are designed for different groups when playing. Below I give three song examples for each group, which I think has a good solo part for that particular group. Obviously each song must still incorporate the group. Links are provided to listen to the song yourself.

Guitar Solo’s:
· Layla (Eric Clapton) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2sfelvHAlU)
· Hotel California (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8I2DqhTcZrA) (The Eagles)
· Chasing Cars (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxXwIIBlSgw) (Snow Patrol)

Drummer:
· Philadeplphia (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L9_8vwx2w8) (Bruce Sprinsteen)
· In the Morning (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1LXQK950SM) (Razorlight)

Vocalist:
· American Pie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHkT2YfqHE4) (Don Maclean)

(Anymore cos I’m struggling where it’s just a solo for the vocalist!?)

3) DIVERSITY: Already Rockband has hit the nail on the head with the tracklist in my opinion. The DLC needs to cater for everyone. Personally I can’t stand metal, but I do love the Acoustic side of rock (probably shows in my song selection). I appreciate this makes people puke and they want nothing but hardcore heavy rock. That’s no problem, but diversity is what rules and there needs to be this in the selection of DLC. And let’s not forget the old classics to bring the appeal of this game to a wider audience (such as our parents!). You tell me who wouldn’t want to play:

· Brown Eyed Girl (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBNADJuOufs) – Van Morrison!

Also I pray the developers are not scared to try new songs. As already stated, Sherly Crows “If it makes you happy” might not be a persons first choice when it comes to Rock…but it does hit all the right buttons and characteristics of what makes a good Rockband song.

4) RISK: Not all songs should be risky as most of the time it alienates many of the players, but its rewards ‘can’ be huge. These are songs where maybe ONLY the drummer and vocalist play for half the song, or maybe its just the guitarist on his own, but ultimately everyone plays together at a particular point to achieve characteristic number 1 & 2 respectively.

Secondly, on some VERY rare songs I’d love to see a song that is ONLY for one or two of the group. Examples of this are below:

Riskiest Teamwork song as an example:
· Fix You (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBEYyHGbwto)– (Coldplay) - mainly vocalist and bassist for most of song then drummer and lead come in halfway through


Guitarists & Vocalist:
· Hallelujah (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AratTMGrHaQ)(Jeff Buckley) – great acoustic song for guitarist and vocalist
· Golden Touch (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdA5IcjWcIs) (Razorlight) - bassist and lead solos!

Drummer:

· We will Rock You (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iikKzQwgBJc) (Queen)

Of course the above songs need to be VERY rare in the DLC, but it could create a huge following of fans among those groups. Maybe only 1 in 50 songs that are released to be like this or even higher. The main point is that I just hope the developers aren’t scared to experiment and take that odd risk on some of the songs rather than play it safe 100% of them.


Please present your own songs to prove or disprove any of the theories presented. Either way, what is shown in this thread shows the pure potential of Rockband.

***I appreciate the example songs are limited in scope and may make some of you puke out of my taste. But they are there for example purposes. You guys may well have far better examples than what I present so let’s not get bogged down in the song selections as its kinda not point of this thread! It's all about encouraging discussion!***

[bumbousdude25]

Whoa. That's really deep.


Great! :D I don't really know what else to say...

[foolosophy]

Readymade by RHCP would make a wicked teamwork song. After London Calling this is my most wanted song in Rock Band (Considering we got a song by RHCP from Stadium Arcadium I might actually get this one!). It has great parts for each instrument where the whole band almost shuts off and spotlights on instrument and then the next instrument and so forth.

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I agree on Brown Eyed Girl, I would be really surprised if they added that. Good song.

[the_sas_man]

I agree on Brown Eyed Girl, I would be really surprised if they added that. Good song.

That's what worries me - are they prepared to take a risk on a song that arguably works as a Rockband song? Here's hoping.

[foolosophy]

Yeah and if they add Buckley's Hallelujah that intro would be awesome.

[HeXcoda]

That's a GREAT writeup, there. Major kudos to you for recognizing everything that has to go into what makes a good Rock Band song!

My thinking is that not all DLC is going to be as prime-cut as the on-disk stuff, though. Not that it'll be WORSE but they may work outside the guidelines... after all, these are optional buys, and that means you can tailor them to someone's individual desires.

For instance, consider that they're going to be publishing entire albums. Not every track on an album will make a good Rock Band song but for completionist's sake they'll roll with it anyway; that's proof that they may make more "specialized" songs, IE ones where an instrument is missing or another is heavily emphasized.

[masterx1918]

those are some of the worst suggested DLC songs I have ever seen. Sheryl Crow? Snow Patrol? Razorlight? are you serious?

[the_sas_man]

Thank you all so far for your comments, great to have discussions without the *****ing.

Your 100% right there HeXcoda. By releasing albums some of the songs on a particular album won't fit with my utopia version of what makes a good Rockband song. But as long as the albums are diverse enough (i.e a 60's collection to a hard core metal collection) then hopefully there will be some real gems in there.

And @ Foolosophy - I agree. The intro would be amazing!

[the_sas_man]

those are some of the worst suggested DLC songs I have ever seen. Sheryl Crow? Snow Patrol? Razorlight? are you serious?


You read the actual post? If not just skip to the end of it with the stars! Thank You.

[whofan]

Great work at the analysis. I really agree with it. A lot of the song selections made me go "Wha?", but some of them are really great.

In terms of risk, let's take that to the next step here. Let's go with songs that would be amazing for Rock Band, but will probably not even be considered by the normal person.

Submitted for your approval is *drumroll*:

"The Flame Still Burns" by Strange Fruit (from the movie "Still Crazy)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpRS-ebhbS0

(Copy and paste in your address bar, I'm no good at this internet code stuff)

It's slow starting but it really picks up (ignore the video, it's the song I want highlighted) and I think that this song would really work in Rock Band.

Regardless, I really like your analysis, keep up the good work!

[the_sas_man]

Awesome song! I heard that somewhere before but never knew what it was called! Totally agree with it.

And thats the point - RISK is what could make or break this game. That song you gave is something I may never of considered but would make a good RockBand song as it emphasises teamwork.

[RkBndDrmr]

Great post sas.

I agree. And songs like Brown Eyed Girl, and If It Makes You Happy or Play That Funky Music would make for good songs to play. I think it is gonna depend on how the DLC is going...and the price. If a ton of people are DL a bunch of songs and keep wanting more more more then they may be more likely to add the "risk" songs.

[Keebler]

If you want an interesting U2 song for all 4 instrument, I'd recommend "Where the Streets Have No Name" above "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For."

But yeah, what a great analysis. :)

[the_sas_man]

The thing with the song choices is that I will aghree that some of them are not great.

I'd never buy or download Sherly Crow's "If it makes you Happy" as its not really my kind of song - but it does work REALLY well as a RockBand song, and I know out there would like that kinda of song.

So it's great to see so many of you take an interest in the actual meaning behind my post rather than the songs themselves.

The streets Have no Name is an awesome song. Ideally, they would release Joshua Tree and have all the songs anyway!

[jlc510]

Rest assure that HMX has already thought of this and have a game plan to their DLC. As much as I think the current set list is weak, it seems to me that they know what they want from this game and have for a long time. I'm sure their main goal is to make as much money as possible, so they're going to release DLC that's going to make money. They're also going to release stuff from bands that they "think you should hear" as they've said in previous interviews. As far as risk DLC goes, I could see them releasing packs of songs that's made mainly for vocalist and another pack mainly for guitarists and of course a pack of songs that's made for drummers I.E. Wipeout. I think the key to DLC that you're missing out on is if it will be compatable with future games or not, that's the key to this franchise (not the game) being a succsess or not in the long run and the freedom that they'd have to release riskier DLC .

[the_sas_man]

As far as risk DLC goes, I could see them releasing packs of songs that's made mainly for vocalist and another pack mainly for guitarists and of course a pack of songs that's made for drummers


I REALLY hope your right on that one. As you quite rightly said, money is what they are after and who can blame them. But having released successful mainstream albums/songs (such as The Killer album which they know will sell bucketloads) will they take a risk on a song like Brown Eyed Girl - Van Morrison? Something tells me they won't even though its a great Rockband song to play simply because of the money factor.

I know its impossible to cater for everones tastes, but they really do need to be risky and say "right, lets release a song from the 60's after we done these three albums and after that we will release a risky song for the Death Metal fans out there, or the Heavy Rock fans" etc. I guess its about misxing that Risk factor with Diversity.

Your point about the DLC being compatible with future games is absolutely right and one I hadn't thought of before. I'm not going to spend maybe 10-15 pound on DLC if it becomes void on the next Rockband game. Basically I wouldn't buy Rockband 2. But I'm sure they aren't stupid when it comes to that. Well I hope not anyway!

You make some good points there!

[RkBndDrmr]

Depending on how well DLC pans out, and again if they are making $$ I do see stuff like Brown Eyed Girl being released. HMX is listening. HMX is reading. HMX will do future homework to see who is playing the game. If there are a lot of people aged 30+ playing the game they will put out more older stuff. If they find that a bunch of 12 year old girls are playing, they may release some...ummm..I don't even want to think about that. But I'm sure if they are making a good profit on things they will throw out something they may not work. If things work out, we'll see more. If not they will bite it and never do it again lol.

From what's been said, HMX has grand plans. If enough people buy the game, and continue to DL music, we'll see a lot of cool stuff.

[tucsonovernite]

I'm just glad this was posted before they finalized the DLC cause man don't know what hamonix woulda done w/ out it. Cause Metallica, the WHo ANd Grateful Dead just ain't cuttin it ya know. Don't think anyone had put any thought into dlc before

[whofan]

I'm just glad this was posted before they finalized the DLC cause man don't know what hamonix woulda done w/ out it. Cause Metallica, the WHo ANd Grateful Dead just ain't cuttin it ya know. Don't think anyone had put any thought into dlc before

Boy, I'm glad to see you're being quite helpful here (Just in case you can't tell, that's sarcasm). Of course, coming from you it's no real surprise that you post something that does not contribute to the discussion at all.

The point is not that the current DLC isn't cutting it (The Who and Grateful Dead are amazing bands, and while I really dislike Metallica I acknowledge their importance in rock history), the point is that it should be used as a venue to express as many different styles as possible and expose people to songs they may not otherwise consider.

We're not saying ignore the big guns and popular stuff, but we're saying also take risks.

For example, my suggestion would make a great addition to Rock Band, but how many people here have heard it? 1 out of every 100? If we're lucky.

Conversly, you can stick with the big acts as well, but you don't have to pick the greatest hits. I'd much rather see anything off of "Quadrophenia" (Love, Reign O'er Me, Cut My Hair, Quadrophenia, I've Had Enough, The Rock, The Real Me, Sea And Sand) than any of the tracks on "Who's Next". A groups best music is not limited to their greatest hits and often it is the more obscure stuff that would be a lot more fun to play.

Maybe if you had read the initial post in full and the ensuing discussion you'd realize what is being said here. We're not knocking Harmonix or their approach, we're making suggestions which MAY not have been considered.

[blackjack]

If you want an interesting U2 song for all 4 instrument, I'd recommend "Where the Streets Have No Name" above "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For."

But yeah, what a great analysis. :)


NO just NO... you dont deserve to submit song ideas. U2 SUCKS.

[Atsumi]

I was thinking special packages for DLC.

Like a singer pack, a guitar pack, bass back, drum pack, blah blah blah and you can select and buy which one you like most.

[blue_dragonzero]

:mad: You forgot 2112!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:

[MdubMedia]

Great analysis. I have nothing left to say haha.