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Originally Posted by Epsilon82

There will always be a point where you can't improve a lot any more in any game of this nature. That's not a reason to completely destroy the most logical high-scoring combo in the game when considering the quotient of skill required for effective use.

And you better get used to Pinball/Sync, because it's pretty obvious that these tournaments are just going to devolve into who has the best/luckiest run with that. Pinball shouldn't even be in the game, IMO, because it's completely divorced from anything remotely related to interacting with the music. It's a funny little novelty but the notion that it now is probably the most practical route to a high score in a beatmatch rhythm game is ludicrous beyond belief. If they're going to nerf Flames like this (which in 99% of use cases were a completely legitimate part of the game), they'd better nerf the utter crap out of Pinball, because it's a skill that has nothing to do with interacting with music.

Also, I don't think Zage intended for that 100% luck comment to be taken literally. Of course there is always a baked-in element of luck involved in the game to a certain extent. Sometimes my Jack/Flame runs will be better or worse based on where flames happen to spread during an activation. That's part of what keeps it fresh; otherwise, it would devolve into a simple pattern memorization exercise. But the key fundamental point he's making is that it's completely wrong for a combo like Road Rage or Bottle Rockets with Blast Notes to be more prolific than even an expertly executed Jackpot/Flame run. I don't see how anyone can argue against that, unless they literally have no interest in separating skilled players from novices, which is completely contrary to the entire notion of a competitive scoring game.

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Epsilon is right in everything he says. The point is the harder the combo the more points you should get. I started off Blitz using the Jackpot/Blast combo. This took some skill at first but over time became easy. It also had a limit on the amount of score I could get. The rare time I would get lucky with a Blast placement. The point is eventually it was to easy.

Than I learned about Jackpot/Flame. This combo was much more challenging. While in a Jackpot run in Blitz mode you had to quickly switch lanes to catch Flame notes. There was always the possibly of making a mistake. It stayed challenging.

I am sorry that some people were not good enough to do this. That is no excuse to nerf the power up. The people who wanted the nerf need to realize. The same people who were dominating with Flame notes will dominate with whatever the next Powerful combo is. The problem now is the leaderboards being broken.

The real problem with this game has always been Blitz mode. Blitz mode is what makes this game challenging. But there has never been a scoring benefit to being in Blitz mode. Heck the game is named after Blitz mode yet it does nothing for your score.

How many people will press a note button in empty space during a solo just to not go in to Blitz mode? How many people break a not streak before a Jackpot/Flame run would start? And obviously we have heard how many people button mashed with Bandmate/Flame never having to go in to Blitz mode.

Yet this was what the game was named after. Increasing the value of Blitz mode would have solved most of the problems being discussed in these forums. However that would have made the game even harder not easier. It sounds to me that Harmonix wants an easy game that anyone can win.

Makes me wonder why they called it Rock Band Blitz. They should have called it Rock Band for kids. I just hope those kids who play it for fun spend as much money as I did buying songs $$$ cause i am done.

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Originally Posted by cowboys282

Makes me wonder why they called it Rock Band Blitz. They should have called it Rock Band for kids. I just hope those kids who play it for fun spend as much money as I did buying songs $$$ cause i am done.

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are you serious, hahaha pathetic

Are you serious? If anything staying in blitz mode makes it easier to hit a a flood of notes. I could not hit those megadeth solos on RB Blitz if I wasn't in blitz mode. I need the speed to be able to see the timing and spacing between each note.

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Originally Posted by cowboys282

The same people who were dominating with Flame notes will dominate with whatever the next Powerful combo is. The problem now is the leaderboards being broken.

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Excellent point. I'm inclined to think that the top edge of the leaderboards for Tournaments will consist primarily of preternaturally skilled or supremely lucky Pinball users (a skill that has no bearing whatsoever on the skill the game purports to be engaging,) but you're completely right that the better players will still do better than others on the remaining valid combos. So from that standpoint this change will have accomplished nothing other than to make the game less fun and engaging due to the absence of the viability of skill-based combos, have less balance in terms of risk/reward mechanics, and break the leaderboards on both a global and even individual basis.

The good news is that Harmonix can fix this just as easily as they broke it. Just say that this was an experimental temporary change and put things back where they were, and all will be well again, at least by comparison to the present. I just hope they don't take the route of most American corporations (and politicians) and refuse to ever acknowledge any mistakes for fear of being seen as weak or stupid. Everybody makes mistakes, even the incredible team at Harmonix who assembled this ingenious game and so many others in the first place. What's important is to recognize and fix them instead of digging in under some misguided sense of pride.

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Originally Posted by zage1337

Are you serious? If anything staying in blitz mode makes it easier to hit a a flood of notes. I could not hit those megadeth solos on RB Blitz if I wasn't in blitz mode. I need the speed to be able to see the timing and spacing between each note.

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Totally agreed. At the very beginning it felt like it was too fast for me, but it quickly got to the point where if I lose Blitz mode, it's much harder for me to make out notes, especially Flames in tighter note tracks, which can be disastrous if Jackpot is activated.

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Originally Posted by Mircosoft93

are you serious, hahaha pathetic

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Whats pathetic is that you think getting rid of Flame notes will allow you to finally compete with the higher skilled players. I hate to break it to you but it won't.

Skill always wins out no matter how easy they make the game for people like you.

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Originally Posted by Epsilon82

Totally agreed. At the very beginning it felt like it was too fast for me, but it quickly got to the point where if I lose Blitz mode, it's much harder for me to make out notes, especially Flames in tighter note tracks, which can be disastrous if Jackpot is activated.

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I don't disagree with either of you. I was simply trying to point out the ineffective point system as it relates to Blitz mode. I want Blitz mode to be worth more therefore those who can play while always in Blitz mode get rewarded. Once again rewarding higher skilled players.

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Originally Posted by cowboys282

Whats pathetic is that you think getting rid of Flame notes will allow you to finally compete with the higher skilled players. I hate to break it to you but it won't.

Skill always wins out no matter how easy they make the game for people like you.

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um Microsoft93 is very skilled in this game so I wouldn't rule him as a lesser player If I was you. He can most certainly hold his own with ease.

It feels like this topic is starting to derail and become just a fight...

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Originally Posted by cowboys282

Whats pathetic is that you think getting rid of Flame notes will allow you to finally compete with the higher skilled players. I hate to break it to you but it won't.

Skill always wins out no matter how easy they make the game for people like you.

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yeah, hopefully I'll be able to 4-star Always and Pumped Up Kicks then

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Originally Posted by zage1337

um Microsoft93 is very skilled in this game so I wouldn't rule him as a lesser player If I was you. He can most certainly hold his own with ease.

It feels like this topic is starting to derail and become just a fight...

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To be honest it derailed as soon as Aaron came out and said they made a change. All I have seen today is people arguing in circles.