Chart Discussion Thread

[Swivle]

Hm..I think you should move the right hand hi-hat to the blue, because when you play it on the drums, your right hand is always hitting the same thing, never moving. It's your left that's moving. Does that make sense?

[JesusSilencio]

Hm..I think you should move the right hand hi-hat to the blue, because when you play it on the drums, your right hand is always hitting the same thing, never moving. It's your left that's moving. Does that make sense?

Yeah, I think that's what HMX was thinking, but that's not the way I actually play the part. I edited my other post, adding the sticking that I use.

The thing is, other people may find it more natural to just play it like you describe. It's simpler, but it requires you to keep 16th notes at ~98 bpm on the right hand, which is pretty fast (although I think Clairvoyant is faster). My way is a little more difficult to wrap your head around, but once you get it, it's easier.

[Swivle]

Ah ok, I see it now. Yeah, I think the way you have it in your first post is good. I tend to do similar sticking on really fast right-handed hi-hat runs, like Let There Be Rock, where I add my left hand in to help out my right on the hi-hat, so that should be fine.

[DavyinaToga]

@NoahTheDuke: Cool thread, brah. I may have to use this thread at some point soon, until open beta starts (not now, since I can't recall some of the things that I was debating with myself over them).

On the Hard charting you were asking about, what if you changed it so it was R- OB? That way, the Hard difficulty can still get the feel of that trill-ish lick, while avoiding any fast leaps to that orange from the red, and also getting that strong Blue on the downbeat (which'll help them keep tempo). Don't forget to leave those red sustains in Hard, too. The docs state that you don't have to shorten any lengths until Medium, and those red ones shouldn't impair a Hard player.



@JesusSilencio: Leave the hi-hat as all yellows. The sound of those half-open HH flams aren't very noticeable to my ears; they come across as simple accents. Kudos for knowing some tricky drum licks, though. I can at least appreciate the effort that went into them, if not the acoustic quality.

Actually, I agree with Swivle about making them all blue. That way you can move up to yellow at the start of the tom fill and work your way back down.

Speaking of Swivle...



Swiv, I hope I don't sound like an ass for this, but I have no idea what you are talking about when you mention NotB. There's plenty of red paradiddles (hitting the same pad twice in quick succession with the same hand), hihat/snare hits, and tom flams, but no hi-hat flams charted for the song that I'm aware of (unless you're talking about the cover version, which I've never played. Then I wouldn't know anyway).

Also, when you mention using your left hand to help on hi-hat in Let There Be Rock, are you sweeping your left for the snare or avoiding strong beats with your right? I ask because the only ways I can see a left hand effectively being used within hihat lines are if there are occasional 16th notes tossed in between the 8ths (which LTBR doesn't do; it's straight-up 8th-note rock the whole song), or if it's a disco beat with hihat on Red, so your right hand can hit a yellow snare easier in between a constant run of 16ths (a la Everlong).

OORRRRRRR... do you play on hard and I'm just making a fool of myself trying to understand? (<--Probably that)

[JesusSilencio]

@JesusSilencio: Leave the hi-hat as all yellows. The sound of those half-open HH flams aren't very noticeable to my ears; they come across as simple accents. Kudos for knowing some tricky drum licks, though. I can at least appreciate the effort that went into them, if not the acoustic quality.

Actually, I agree with Swivle about making them all blue. That way you can move up to yellow at the start of the tom fill and work your way back down.

Yeah, I was originally planning on keeping them all as yellows, but I figured I'd ask and see what people thought. And the part isn't terribly difficult once you know how to do it. I mainly play it like that to keep myself from rushing, and also just to keep myself interested.

Also, the drum fill actually starts on the snare, so moving the hi-hat to blue like that wouldn't really be necessary.

Swiv, I hope I don't sound like an ass for this, but I have no idea what you are talking about when you mention NotB. There's plenty of red paradiddles (hitting the same pad twice in quick succession with the same hand), hihat/snare hits, and tom flams, but no hi-hat flams charted for the song that I'm aware of (unless you're talking about the cover version, which I've never played. Then I wouldn't know anyway).

I had to double check this just to be sure, but actually, the original version has flams on the hi-hat, whereas the cover doesn't. I'm not sure how you got them confused if you only played the original version.

Also, just some very minor nitpicks about your terminology. Technically, a "paradiddle" is anything with the sticking RLRR or LRLL, what you describe is just called a "diddle". Also, those double hits on the toms, he's hitting two different toms at the same time, which technically isn't a flam. Not trying to be a dick or anything (sorry if I come off that way), just thought you would like to know .

Also, when you mention using your left hand to help on hi-hat in Let There Be Rock, are you sweeping your left for the snare or avoiding strong beats with your right? I ask because the only ways I can see a left hand effectively being used within hihat lines are if there are occasional 16th notes tossed in between the 8ths (which LTBR doesn't do; it's straight-up 8th-note rock the whole song), or if it's a disco beat with hihat on Red, so your right hand can hit a yellow snare easier in between a constant run of 16ths (a la Everlong).

OORRRRRRR... do you play on hard and I'm just making a fool of myself trying to understand? (<--Probably that)

I think he means playing it like this, but I'm not totally sure:

OOOOOO R
OOOOOO RL
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO L
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO RL
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO L
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO RL
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO L
caps

That way, his right hand doesn't get really tired.

[NoThru22]

Are we sure there aren't cymbal flams in a few songs like one of the new AFI songs? What's going on when they're alternating blue and yellow and then hitting blue AND yellow in some of these songs and I only hear cymbal like sounds?

[davidshek]

Hm..I think you should move the right hand hi-hat to the blue, because when you play it on the drums, your right hand is always hitting the same thing, never moving. It's your left that's moving. Does that make sense?

I agree. Author it just like HMX did The Number of the Beast (original version) intro. Blue and yellow, not yellow and red.

[JesusSilencio]

Are we sure there aren't cymbal flams in a few songs like one of the new AFI songs? What's going on when they're alternating blue and yellow and then hitting blue AND yellow in some of these songs and I only hear cymbal like sounds?

I haven't seen the drum charts to the AFI songs, but they do chart cymbal flams, like in the Iron Maiden songs mentioned previously, and (off the top of my head) there's a flam on the ride during the intro to Jeremy. The reason we're discussing it is because the flams I'm playing sound almost like just plain accents, and they would be sorta awkward to chart anyway.

Edit: Thanks for the advice David. It does seems like people disagree about the best way to chart it though, so I'm not quite sure what to do.

[DavyinaToga]

I had to double check this just to be sure, but actually, the original version has flams on the hi-hat, whereas the cover doesn't. I'm not sure how you got them confused if you only played the original version.

Also, just some very minor nitpicks about your terminology. Technically, a "paradiddle" is anything with the sticking RLRR or LRLL, what you describe is just called a "diddle". Also, those double hits on the toms, he's hitting two different toms at the same time, which technically isn't a flam. Not trying to be a dick or anything (sorry if I come off that way), just thought you would like to know .

No prob. I know my ears aren't trained well enough for drums to pick out that kind of stuff (nor is my drum terminology great), so I was kind of half going by the charts, too. Being a musician myself, it's safe to assume that if I have a hard time picking up that kind of stuff, Joe Shmoe is gonna have an even harder time.

Could you point out where in the original the HH flam is at? I'm curious to see (and eventually hear, too) it. I've never noticed one in the original version, and I only consulted the drum chart for the cover right before posting (which looks like red snare hits are the only thing paired with yellow, from what I can deduce).[/ignore]

I think he means playing it like this, but I'm not totally sure:

OOOOOO R
OOOOOO RL
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO L
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO RL
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO L
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO RL
OOOOOO R
OOOOOO L
caps

That way, his right hand doesn't get really tired.

I figured it would be something like that, which I can't fathom being able to play without a LOT of training to keep my dominant hand playing everything EXCEPT the beats. *sweat*

EDIT: IIiiiiiiiiii'm dumb. I forgot about the solo HH section in the intro. For some reason I was starting at the tom fill leading into the first verse.

[davidshek]

Could you point out where in the original the HH flam is at? I'm curious to see (and eventually hear, too) it. I've never noticed one in the original version, and I only consulted the drum chart for the cover right before posting (which looks like red snare hits are the only thing paired with yellow, from what I can deduce).

In Number of the Beast? The entire drum intro, measures 36-50, section entitled "Gtr Intro A":

http://rockband.scorehero.com/images...pert_blank.png

Those Yellow/Blues are hi-hat flams. In the cover version, the cover drummer didn't play flams, so that whole intro was authored to just yellows.